Cosworth built EVO 4G63 cylinder head

[4g63lover]

cylinder head

$3000+ price tag. is it worth it? or should I just get a stock head and build it up?

discuss.

seth, cali, stewi chime in

[Cali]

cylinder head

$3000+ price tag. is it worth it? or should I just get a stock head and build it up?

discuss.

seth, cali, stewi chime in

actually it's closer to $4000! (3849.00). there is no reason whatsoever you would need that unless your determined to squeeze every single possible pony out of your motor or you literaly have some pretty damn deep pockets.

just get a regular head. in reality there's no reason to even "build" it up (excepts cams) as the stock design flows pretty damn well for an oem piece. there's tons of evo guys running 400-500whp with no head work at all. (again, excepts cams)

i saw a head (VIII) the other day for 700 shipped on evom.

[4g63lover]

whoa.. really? so glad i registered on there I got a feeling ill get most of my parts from there. Im gunna run the 2.4 EVO motor and I plan to make big numbers... maybe even go for 700hp and AWD in the future. thats why I was looking at the cosworth head. How much boost will the OEM DOHC EVO head be able to handle??

[4-G-rim]

cylinder head

$3000+ price tag. is it worth it? or should I just get a stock head and build it up?

discuss.

seth, cali, stewi chime in

Its no use to spend that much $$$ for a car thats going to see mostly street use. When you get extreme like that...you start to lose streetablity. Dont spend money if you don't need to. Like what Cali said...stock 4G63 heads flow pretty dayam well in OEM specs and lots of DSM/EVO guys/gals are power some serious and respectable power with virgin cylinder heads.

That cylinder head is made for SERIOUS race applications and use...........real serious.

[seth98esT]

Cosworth makes quality quality quality head work! If you have deep pockets, then by all means, buy that beast! But seriously, a normal person would just get a stock Evo head, maybe have it ported, get titanium valves and retainers, cams, maybe a 3-angle job and call it day all for under $1500 probably.

[Xska55]

Wow thats a serious cyl. head, its a nice piece but it doesnt sound like you need it at all especailly if you coming on here asking if its worth it. For 4g's could build youself a real nice street motor.

[Stewi]

Wow thats a serious cyl. head, its a nice piece but it doesnt sound like you need it at all especailly if you coming on here asking if its worth it. For 4g's could build youself a real nice street motor.

Cosworth makes top quality products. However, like everyone else has said, its not worth it. Just to put things in perspective for you, you can get an OEM EVO head from the dealer for $850, Pay AMS $1800 for a full race port job, which includes 1mm over valves, springs and titanium retainers, then buy a set of HKS cams for $580 and still money left over. There are people with a stock EVO head and HKS cams making nearly 600awhp. You have to also account for the drivetrain loss percentage. 600awhp in an EVO is like 635whp in a FWD. Like 4-G-Rim said about the car not being streetable, he is 100% right. When my car was working (which wasnt very often :( ) it totally sucked driving around town, its soo loud, if you really lay into the pedal you just start spinning the tires, not too much fun on the street. I can credit the driveability issues to my old standalone which after alot of trial and error ending up being a bad choice. Napalm over on club3g daily drives his car, he's got about 10,000 miles on it already without any real trouble, so I think AEM EMS is really the only way to make a high horsepower and some what reliable daily car. Even with that said he has a ton of traction problems and he has JIC suspension, Quaife LSD and 235 series tires up front. No Dyno numbers on him yet but he has to be in the high 400's if you talking about 700's thats gonna be killer, even if you swap to AWD, EVO guys are breaking rear axles and transfer cases and even when it all works they sometimes have traction problems.

[4g63lover]

Cosworth makes top quality products. However, like everyone else has said, its not worth it. Just to put things in perspective for you, you can get an OEM EVO head from the dealer for $850, Pay AMS $1800 for a full race port job, which includes 1mm over valves, springs and titanium retainers, then buy a set of HKS cams for $580 and still money left over. There are people with a stock EVO head and HKS cams making nearly 600awhp. You have to also account for the drivetrain loss percentage. 600awhp in an EVO is like 635whp in a FWD. Like 4-G-Rim said about the car not being streetable, he is 100% right. When my car was working (which wasnt very often :( ) it totally sucked driving around town, its soo loud, if you really lay into the pedal you just start spinning the tires, not too much fun on the street. I can credit the driveability issues to my old standalone which after alot of trial and error ending up being a bad choice. Napalm over on club3g daily drives his car, he's got about 10,000 miles on it already without any real trouble, so I think AEM EMS is really the only way to make a high horsepower and some what reliable daily car. Even with that said he has a ton of traction problems and he has JIC suspension, Quaife LSD and 235 series tires up front. No Dyno numbers on him yet but he has to be in the high 400's if you talking about 700's thats gonna be killer, even if you swap to AWD, EVO guys are breaking rear axles and transfer cases and even when it all works they sometimes have traction problems.

Yeah, I want the car to be semi-streetable. After all the work Ill be doing the car will barely be driven unless its to a racetrack.. I want to build it as a street strip car that can be driven to the race, run a couple of runs, and drive it back. I mean, I will drive the car probably on the weekends but it wont be my daily. I'm getting another 8G or a 7G for a daily. I want big power. But I wont be buying this cylinder head. It's obviously a race head. AMS is in Arlington heights which is maybe 30 minutes to 45 minutes away from me so when I start building my motor, you guys will hear a lot of AMS from me.

[Stewi]

Yeah, I want the car to be semi-streetable. After all the work Ill be doing the car will barely be driven unless its to a racetrack.. I want to build it as a street strip car that can be driven to the race, run a couple of runs, and drive it back. I mean, I will drive the car probably on the weekends but it wont be my daily. I'm getting another 8G or a 7G for a daily. I want big power. But I wont be buying this cylinder head. It's obviously a race head. AMS is in Arlington heights which is maybe 30 minutes to 45 minutes away from me so when I start building my motor, you guys will hear a lot of AMS from me.

By "Big power" do you want just overall big horsepower like chasing a Dyno number or do you want big useable power? If you just want to say "Hey look my car made 1,200 whp!" your best bet is to build the motor, slap a T88 on there, huge injectors and pump, sheet metal intake and a standalone and your done. However if you want big useable horsepower you kinda need to spread things out. Personally I think any Street/Strip FWD car should be making no more then 500whp. Thats simply my opinion. Because the car is flat out uncontrollable when your at WOT and high boost. When my car was making 370whp and I floored it in first or second gear on the street it was loose as hell because of all the torque steer. On the track it wasnt really that bad. Your best bet for a street/strip car is to make street tune at lets say 15psi which would limit you to around 400whp and then a race tune for like 25-35psi on C16 or pump gas and meth injection however you want to make it work. This way your not driving around all the time putting a ton of stress on the motor, killing your tires, tranny, clutch, etc. The other way is to just make one tune and just dont boost the car as high but usually if you do that you get alot of lag because your not making 2 seperate distinguished tunes for each use. I'll tell you now, if you can make 500-550whp and somehow get the tires to hook up, your talking about a low 11 second high 10 second car. Those are very respectable numbers.

[4g63lover]

By "Big power" do you want just overall big horsepower like chasing a Dyno number or do you want big useable power? If you just want to say "Hey look my car made 1,200 whp!" your best bet is to build the motor, slap a T88 on there, huge injectors and pump, sheet metal intake and a standalone and your done. However if you want big useable horsepower you kinda need to spread things out. Personally I think any Street/Strip FWD car should be making no more then 500whp. Thats simply my opinion. Because the car is flat out uncontrollable when your at WOT and high boost. When my car was making 370whp and I floored it in first or second gear on the street it was loose as hell because of all the torque steer. On the track it wasnt really that bad. Your best bet for a street/strip car is to make street tune at lets say 15psi which would limit you to around 400whp and then a race tune for like 25-35psi on C16 or pump gas and meth injection however you want to make it work. This way your not driving around all the time putting a ton of stress on the motor, killing your tires, tranny, clutch, etc. The other way is to just make one tune and just dont boost the car as high but usually if you do that you get alot of lag because your not making 2 seperate distinguished tunes for each use. I'll tell you now, if you can make 500-550whp and somehow get the tires to hook up, your talking about a low 11 second high 10 second car. Those are very respectable numbers.

I'm not chasing a dyno number but I am wanting big numbers. On the street I would just crank the boost down and then when i go to the track ill just crank it up. But I want a 11 or even 10 second car.... well, I'm planning to use slicks on race days. and D.O.T. drag radials like the Nitto NT555R for the street. again, the car will only be driven on occasion and the track. She wont be a trailer queen but she wont be a daily driver.

[Stewi]

I'm not chasing a dyno number but I am wanting big numbers. On the street I would just crank the boost down and then when i go to the track ill just crank it up. But I want a 11 or even 10 second car.... well, I'm planning to use slicks on race days. and D.O.T. drag radials like the Nitto NT555R for the street. again, the car will only be driven on occasion and the track. She wont be a trailer queen but she wont be a daily driver.

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Mathematically (which we all know is never ever correct) it would take 491whp to run a 10.9925. That number is in ideal conditions, with an absolute perfect driver and perfect traction. So now for some realistic numbers. 500whp EVO's run high 10's with like 1.7 60ft times in a car that weighs nearly the same as an 8g. There is no way your getting a 1.70 60ft time in a FWD car without huge slicks and axles strong enough not to snap if you do get traction, I would say any 2.0 or less 60ft time would be considered good. I dont think your goals are out of reach, but its gonna take alot to get there.

[4g63lover]

I dont think your goals are out of reach, but its gonna take alot to get there.

And I will do anything to get there.... Does DSS make driveshafts for our cars or is it a 3G application? or if they don't, who does? custom?

[seth98esT]

http://www.driveshaftshop.com

[4g63lover]

http://www.driveshaftshop.com

Thx Seth, they dunt have any for the 4cyl 3G.......

[seth98esT]

They can custom make one for you.

[Stewi]

They can custom make one for you.

Yeah they do it custom, I think they quoted me like $750 for a custom set. I am sooo mad that they moved their shop. Their shop used to be like 2 blocks from my house.

[qnz]

come on. be serious. i expect a post like this from a tgc newbie but youve been around for a while.