This Can't Be Good

[phizzalot]

Well finally started on my oil seal problem that I've been complaing about for months... I think this oil problem led to a lot of the problems I have and is slowly getting worse...

First I lined up my Crankshaft pulley with the TDC Mark on the plastic cover and the camshaft mark with the mark on the valve cover.

I removed the crankshaft pulley and other pulleys, then the cover.

Now this is where I need help!!! The Balance shaft belt is shredded and broken in half. Also the mark on the oilpump pulley was not aligned with that point on the oil pump casing like stated in the Chilton manual? should I be woried about the oil pump mark ?

My main goal is to replace all the seals.

I know I will have to remove the timing belt to replace the seals, so I just want to make sure Iam on the right track before I mess something up

Here are a few pics of the balance shaft belt

[4-G-rim]

When I tore down the motor in -G-rim I found the same surprise like you...my balance shaft belt was torn and it looked it was like that for some time and luckily it didn't destroy the Tbelt.

Basically you are running a motor with the balance shafts eliminated in a way. You should be ok running like that, but its good to fix it when you can. The mark to where the oil pump pulley should be inline with the crank is for balance shaft sycronization purposes..if anything you should of noticed a little bit of vibration from your motor since the Bshafts aren't rotating and counter balancing each other. VFAQ will have the shop manual how to line it up or your Chiltons.

[phizzalot]

Thanks for the reply g-rim, i may just have to give you a call on this one becuse I read the vfaq timing belt removal guide and is pretty identical to the books process of replacing the belt.

I just stoped when I notced the mark on the oil sprocket did not line up, like the one on vfaq and the book which shows the same place.

I wonder If I should just keep turning clockwise until the oil sprocket mark lines up to the point on the casing and the camshaft mark lines up to the one on the valve cover?

Mine is pointing to the 2Oclock postion unlike this one which is in the 10Oclock postion



I think i will go to the jyard again 2morrow and practice on some other cars to see If I get the same results... Maybe when I changed around the crankshaft pulley something moved ( although I thought that pulley only went on one way)...

[Shadow19]

Thanks for the reply g-rim, i may just have to give you a call on this one becuse I read the vfaq timing belt removal guide and is pretty identical to the books process of replacing the belt.

I just stoped when I notced the mark on the oil sprocket did not line up, like the one on vfaq and the book which shows the same place.

I wonder If I should just keep turning clockwise until the oil sprocket mark lines up to the point on the casing and the camshaft mark lines up to the one on the valve cover?

Mine is pointing to the 2Oclock postion unlike this one which is in the 10Oclock postion



I think i will go to the jyard again 2morrow and practice on some other cars to see If I get the same results... Maybe when I changed around the crankshaft pulley something moved ( although I thought that pulley only went on one way)...

I was never able to get the oil pump dead on.. I tried it 3 times and had a buddy of mine try it a few times.. it was always like 1/2 tooth off when we put tention on the belt.. But i didnt worry about it anyways.. I no longer have balance shafts.. If you dont replace your balance shaft belt.. I wouldnt worry too much about it. Im almost certain that one is pointless without the other.. so the oil pump doesnt really matter i would assume.

[evil-G-nius]

I would say skip the balance shaft all together! You are lucky as Kev said that the balance shaft did not screw up anything else! TO err on the safe side, while you have the engine open check the valves and after do a compression test. Just becase there are no real signs of damage doesnt mean that there isnt any! I'd be on the safe side if I was in your position. Good luck

[4-G-rim]

Let me know if you need help. Lining the timing marks for the oil pump sproket can be a little tricky but I have been able to line it up on the dot.

Just PM me or give me a call if you need help and we can coordinate when to.

[phizzalot]

Thanks Everyone... I didn't know that this could be so tricky :)... Cool I will place the cover back on and give it a few more rotations and see If Ican get the oil pump sprocket to line up correctly :)

Thanks again everyone and will update when I make more progress...

[eksz]

I must be missing something here but this does not seem so complicated. Couldn't you just losen the timing belt tensioner and set the timing marks. If you rebuild an engine (or bust a timing belt) the timing marks all have to be manually reset before installing the new timing belt. The only thing to watch out for is that the balance shaft (assuming you don't delet it) is set correctly. The balance shaft is built up on one side verse the other; remove a plug from the back of the block and stick a screw driver in the hole to ensure you have the balance shaft aligned correctly (see haynes or chilton manual for details).

BYW, did you replace the balance shaft belt when you did the timing belts in the past? Just curious as I always thought if the balance shaft belt broke, it would take out the timing belt. Your pictures show me that is definately not the case.

[seth98esT]

If you remove both balance shafts, it does not matter whether the oil sprocket is in time or not. Trick to getting everything lined up perfectly is to advance the cam gear 1 tooth in advanced(clockwise), then line up all the other marks. When you tension the belt, it will move the timing off 1 tooth or so.

[phizzalot]

EKSZ, I never replaced a timing belt before, I've always taken it to a mechanic but the second to last mechanic charged me 300 for it and the timing was off as well as the balance shaft so the car vibrated like crazy!!!

Then another shop charged me like 300 to get alll the marks together corectly..

Now I also read about the plug on the side of the block but I can't see it (maybe due to old dirt and grime) Is this plug in the direction side where the front bumper is or towards the firewall or is it where the belts are?

[eksz]

Plug is located on the back side of the engine, i.e. between the engine and the firewall (not between the engine and the front bumper). I beleive it was nothing special, just a bolt. I can relate to having to deal with expensive yet incompetent mechanics which is how I started doing my own timing belts.

I have not tried Seth's suggestion for aligning the marks (Trick to getting everything lined up perfectly is to advance the cam gear 1 tooth in advanced(clockwise) , then line up all the other marks. When you tension the belt, it will move the timing off 1 tooth or so. ) because this is the first time I have heard of it it makes lots of sense. I must have been lucky in the past because I have not had any problem in aligning thetimig marks.

BTW, The first couple of times I did Mits timing belts I did not have any of the special tools that are recommended for the job. I have since purchase an adapter for applying pressure to the tensioning pulley but have only found that to be marginally helpful.

[eksz]

I had taken a bunch of pictures intending to do a tutorial on on timing belts but must have dumped them once i saw there was a tutorial on timing belts (see https://www.thegalantcenter.org/showthread.php?t=16604 ) here. Be sure to read the tutorial allthe way to the end as other TGC members made some suggestions to clarify the tutorial.
I make notes in my manuals when I think it may help me out in the future. Under timing belts I noted the plug is a 14mm bolt and it is located below the oxygen sensor wire and below the starter.

Another way to verify the balance shaft is properly orientated is to align the balance shaft mark against the mark on the block. Now rotate the shaft about a half inch one way or the other and see if it does not rotate back towards the mark. If it just moves towards aligning the marks (i.e., moves the little bit you turned it) then you are good. If the shaft rotates more than you turned it then you probably have it 180 degrees out of alignment. In that case rotate the shaft 180 degrees and realign the marks. Now test it again. The reason for this is if the the balance shaft was viewed from its end you would see one side is bigger and heavier than the other. With the mark set correctly the heavier side should be down. Chilton manual #50450, "Mitsbushi Galanyt/Diamante 1990-00" has a picture of this on page 3-39 which I've scanned in here to help you out. The caption for that drawing says it applies to the 1.8L and 2.0L SOHC engines. It also holds true for the 2.4L SOHC engines. As the galant 2.4L SOHC and 2.4L DOHC (found only in 94 galant GS ) engines share the same block (2.4L DOHC has an extra tap for an anti-knock sensor per DOHCStunr) it should also hold true for the DOHC engines. Hopefully I have not made this more complicated than it needs to be.

[phizzalot]

Thanks EKSZ, I will check out that TUT, but for now I have cleaned out the area and put everything back together mainly because I rather work in different location then my APT parking lot :) but I will use this info later to install a new balance belt and seals when I get to a garage...

Thanks again everyone...

[phizzalot]

Well Yesterday I pulled it all apart and lined up the cam gear, found the plug/bolt in the back of the block and was able to slide a screwdriver all the way in :)... I took off the cover and all the gears were aligned correctly so I took off the timing belt and added the balance shaft belt.

One question though? My timing belt tensioner dosen't seem to be compressing, nor is it touching the metal lever to apply tension to the timing belt. I was going to pick up a new one and also adjust that timing pulley (hopefully it works)

Also does that Crank bolt have to be removed to get to the crank seal?

All in all it looks like iam able to get the "G" to at least drive back to my house where I can add some more parts :)

[4-G-rim]

If your auto tensioner is not applying pressure to the tensioner pulley bracket it need to be replaced. Its probably due to get replaced anyways.

The Crank bolt is required to remove the timing belt pulley so you can get the crank seal. A air gun will make life easier when removing it.

[seth98esT]

When you tension the pulley and bolt it tight, if you pull the grenade pin and the rod shoots up at the tensioner arm, then theres not enough tension on the belt. You should be able to pull the pin out and put it right back in. Then rotate the crank about 8 times till everything lines up again, wait 10 minutes, and put the grenade pin back into the auto tensioner. If you cant put the pin back in, then theres not enough tension.

Rule of thumb for me, if your replacing the timing belt, at minimum replace the auto tensioner and the tensioner pulley as well.

[phizzalot]

Thanks for the heads up.. I replaced the auto tensioner and was able to slide the pin in and out. I did not rotate and check to see afterwards however, I started it back up today and the vibration around 3000rpm was gone now :)

I still haven't driven it yet, but I feel a lot more comfortable with replacing the timing belt now. I think I will wait until I can get access to airtools at my parents house before I mess with it again... Thanks for all the help evryone and it sounds nice to have the galant running again :)

By the way Mitsubishi charged me around 100 bucks for the auto tensioner, is that normal price?

[4-G-rim]

That sounds about right..the auto tensioners aren't cheap.