N/A Max Power

[desertfrog]

How many horses can you get out of the four banger galant, without a turbo. I know you can get a diffrent air intake, and a cat back, but with all that plus some other thingsa you could do how much horses can you actually get. Is it cost beneficial? or are you better of saving up for a v6?

[WarmAndSCSI]

If you want N/A power, don't look for it in an inline 4 that can only safely rev to 6500 RPM.

[laxinwarrior]

You won't make virtually any difference without dropping some serious bank on your engine. Also you can't just drop a V6 into an I4 Galant... Search is your friend.

[WarmAndSCSI]

You won't make virtually any difference without dropping some serious bank on your engine. Also you can't just drop a V6 into an I4 Galant... Search is your friend.

You can with a new subframe :lol:

edit: and ECU.

edit2: and wiring harness.

edit3: and new exhaust downpipe.

edit4: and lots of money.

Honestly, people usually stay with N/A because they are intimidated by boost. There's nothing wrong with a turbocharger setup, it's not a cop out. They're used in stock cars all the way to WRC rally cars.

[boostzealot]

here i am about to say this.... the 4g series motors can be impressive NA.... if they are in a car that is only 2000lbs and has over 20k invested into the motor. there is a guy that runs a NA 1st gen dsm with a 4g63 and runs 12s all day but it is not a natural motor by any means. drag money equals drag car....sometimes. go boost man. there is a lot more support and a lot more potential. i mean really how will you feel after your build and are finally done but are still getting your ass handed to you by stock cars? do the right thing and go boost. :wink:

[galant3jl12's]

So whats the consensus for safe boost on a stock 4G64 bout 8-10 psi.

[laxinwarrior]

So whats the consensus for safe boost on a stock 4G64 bout 8-10 psi.

Did you read the title of this thread?

And it all depends on the tune, I have boosted 12 and 15 psi on a stock 64 with no problems whatsoever.

[WarmAndSCSI]

So whats the consensus for safe boost on a stock 4G64 bout 8-10 psi.

Hi, you must have mistaken this thread for the "post whatever the fuck you feel like posting here" thread. :D

[Jeffylou87]

lol.. Hey warm.. you think i can borrow your engine for a while?

[WarmAndSCSI]

lol.. Hey warm.. you think i can borrow your engine for a while?

Ummm, nope. It's going back together this week and it'll soon be tearing up the highways again.

[Kwikfox]

I hope you realize that if you do just an air intake, and exhaust, you wont get a whole lot of more power... if any. Besides, pretty much the only thing you can do with your exhaust is to increase the width of the exhasut... but without being turbocharged, you will lose a lot of torque. Doing an intake doesnt give you a whole lot of horsepower either, if any. A couple things you might wanna look into doing would be to bore and stroke the engine, get bigger cams, and change out the ECU. But ya, search around and you will find out information. When you look, look at what other people have done to other cars to increase horsepower to give you an idea. Because usually if something works on another car, it would probably work on yours.

[WarmAndSCSI]

Besides, pretty much the only thing you can do with your exhaust is to increase the width of the exhasut... but without being turbocharged, you will lose a lot of torque.

Not true, unless you mean just a few ft-lb. Now if he throws a 4" diesel exhaust on it, what you say might hold true.

[boostzealot]

yep thats why my NA exhaust will end up a 3" all the way back. :lol:

[RAZ_76]

Or get a 5spd swap in there first and then do an evo head swap and a 16 to 21 lb turbo and that will feel really good. Lots of work to get that 21lb Turbo but I have seen it done on 4g64 motor.

[WarmAndSCSI]

Or get a 5spd swap in there first and then do an evo head swap and a 16 to 21 lb turbo and that will feel really good. Lots of work to get that 21lb Turbo but I have seen it done on 4g64 motor.

16 or 21 lb turbo? Do you have any idea how stupid you sound?

16 lb or 21 lb refers to boost pressure in PSI, not the size or type or anything of a turbo. Did you possibly mean a 16G turbo?

[Kwikfox]

Or get a 5spd swap in there first and then do an evo head swap and a 16 to 21 lb turbo and that will feel really good. Lots of work to get that 21lb Turbo but I have seen it done on 4g64 motor.

16 or 21 lb turbo? Do you have any idea how stupid you sound?

WTF is up with that comment, I realize you think you know everything about every generation of the G, but you dont have to be an asshole about it. That comment was very uncalled for. You need to stop going around and insulting people like that, you have insulted, or was a smart ass to "GALANTOWNER" and "Racesnos" that I know of. There is no need on this site to be a smart ass, or a prick.

[galant3jl12's]

So whats the consensus for safe boost on a stock 4G64 bout 8-10 psi.

Did you read the title of this thread?

And it all depends on the tune, I have boosted 12 and 15 psi on a stock 64 with no problems whatsoever.

Ya I read the title pal. But those other guys Warm and boostzealot w/ the high hp galants came in talking about boosting seemed like thread was going to shift to that and having read their other threads and posts while they're not very friendly and a little condescending they are very knowledgable.

It is good though to hear about your cars setup laxinwarrior.

[WarmAndSCSI]

Or get a 5spd swap in there first and then do an evo head swap and a 16 to 21 lb turbo and that will feel really good. Lots of work to get that 21lb Turbo but I have seen it done on 4g64 motor.

16 or 21 lb turbo? Do you have any idea how stupid you sound?

WTF is up with that comment, I realize you think you know everything about every generation of the G, but you dont have to be an asshole about it. That comment was very uncalled for. You need to stop going around and insulting people like that, you have insulted, or was a smart ass to "GALANTOWNER" and "Racesnos" that I know of. There is no need on this site to be a smart ass, or a prick.

Would you rather people ran around rampantly spouting off BS like this confusing people who are about to drop cash on their cars? I'll be sure to just ignore any PMs from you and others who want advice or questions answered in the future. People are too easily offended - get OVER it.

I could see you being upset if I said he sounded stupid without explaining why, but I took the time to qualify that statement. And note the wording - I said he sounded stupid by saying that, not that he is actually stupid. Again, what is so offensive about that?

edit: And where in the world do you get the idea that I think I know everything about every generation of Galant? I hardly ever give any advice about 6G's or 7G's unless I have a solid answer or personal experience (which I don't having never worked on either generation). That seems like a personal attack more than anything. Which I'm fine with, but definitely try harder next time. For example, "who thinks he knows everything about the 6G72 platform." Which would be a lot more accurate - find me somebody on this board who knows as much as I do about the V6 Galant/Eclipse GT/GTS engines and tuning thereof and I'll be very impressed.

edit2: and even then, I can think of at least one guy who knows his way around the 6G72, even founded most of his own business on that particular platform. He's not a frequent poster, but I admit he's pretty damn smart.

[seth98esT]

Maybe he meant 16 - 21lb/min.

Thats a small turbo :mrgreen:

[WarmAndSCSI]

Maybe he meant 16 - 21lb/min.

Thats a small turbo :mrgreen:

Na, I think people should just start being more accurate when giving engine/turbo/FI advice in general. It's not like he made that up himself, somebody else used that strange nomenclature and he picked it up.

edit: I guess he could have really been talking about the weight of the turbo... Maybe...

[Serstylz2]

That was a member named Maximus... he had the CMF header, custom intake manifold, he was in search for a new camshaft, had a walbro 255 fuel pump, 60mm throttle body, AEM v2 intake and Dynomax catback exhaust. He was estimating an extra 40-50 ponies with a tune... also had other small mods to help as well

[Kwikfox]

Or get a 5spd swap in there first and then do an evo head swap and a 16 to 21 lb turbo and that will feel really good. Lots of work to get that 21lb Turbo but I have seen it done on 4g64 motor.

16 or 21 lb turbo? Do you have any idea how stupid you sound?

WTF is up with that comment, I realize you think you know everything about every generation of the G, but you dont have to be an asshole about it. That comment was very uncalled for. You need to stop going around and insulting people like that, you have insulted, or was a smart ass to "GALANTOWNER" and "Racesnos" that I know of. There is no need on this site to be a smart ass, or a prick.

Would you rather people ran around rampantly spouting off BS like this confusing people who are about to drop cash on their cars? I'll be sure to just ignore any PMs from you and others who want advice or questions answered in the future. People are too easily offended - get OVER it.

I could see you being upset if I said he sounded stupid without explaining why, but I took the time to qualify that statement. And note the wording - I said he sounded stupid by saying that, not that he is actually stupid. Again, what is so offensive about that?

edit: And where in the world do you get the idea that I think I know everything about every generation of Galant? I hardly ever give any advice about 6G's or 7G's unless I have a solid answer or personal experience (which I don't having never worked on either generation). That seems like a personal attack more than anything. Which I'm fine with, but definitely try harder next time. For example, "who thinks he knows everything about the 6G72 platform." Which would be a lot more accurate - find me somebody on this board who knows as much as I do about the V6 Galant/Eclipse GT/GTS engines and tuning thereof and I'll be very impressed.

edit2: and even then, I can think of at least one guy who knows his way around the 6G72, even founded most of his own business on that particular platform. He's not a frequent poster, but I admit he's pretty damn smart.

First off, I highly doubt anybody was about to dump a lot of cash into their cars off of what GALANTOWNER posted, and if they did go off of only what he said, they deserve any mishaps they encounter, second, their was no need for the insulting phrase at all, whether it was the first or the last sentence, it was not needed.

As for me being offended, I would hardly say I was offended, but more irritated than anything. I saw what you posted to Racesnos, (which happens to be a good friend of mine) about his question a couple weeks ago, which was a pretty smart assed response for a valid question, and I said nothing, I thought it was a slip up, but I see you doing it again, and a little more straitforward I get the feeling that this will become a regular occurance, even one of our newer members galant3jl12's has even noticed it. No matter how you read that sentence it sounds pretty demeaning.

As for my comment about you "thinking you know everything" I say that not as an attack against you, but more a comment on how you make yourself sound when you are talking about your car, and if you took it as an attack, I apologize.

[WarmAndSCSI]

Or get a 5spd swap in there first and then do an evo head swap and a 16 to 21 lb turbo and that will feel really good. Lots of work to get that 21lb Turbo but I have seen it done on 4g64 motor.

16 or 21 lb turbo? Do you have any idea how stupid you sound?

WTF is up with that comment, I realize you think you know everything about every generation of the G, but you dont have to be an asshole about it. That comment was very uncalled for. You need to stop going around and insulting people like that, you have insulted, or was a smart ass to "GALANTOWNER" and "Racesnos" that I know of. There is no need on this site to be a smart ass, or a prick.

Would you rather people ran around rampantly spouting off BS like this confusing people who are about to drop cash on their cars? I'll be sure to just ignore any PMs from you and others who want advice or questions answered in the future. People are too easily offended - get OVER it.

I could see you being upset if I said he sounded stupid without explaining why, but I took the time to qualify that statement. And note the wording - I said he sounded stupid by saying that, not that he is actually stupid. Again, what is so offensive about that?

edit: And where in the world do you get the idea that I think I know everything about every generation of Galant? I hardly ever give any advice about 6G's or 7G's unless I have a solid answer or personal experience (which I don't having never worked on either generation). That seems like a personal attack more than anything. Which I'm fine with, but definitely try harder next time. For example, "who thinks he knows everything about the 6G72 platform." Which would be a lot more accurate - find me somebody on this board who knows as much as I do about the V6 Galant/Eclipse GT/GTS engines and tuning thereof and I'll be very impressed.

edit2: and even then, I can think of at least one guy who knows his way around the 6G72, even founded most of his own business on that particular platform. He's not a frequent poster, but I admit he's pretty damn smart.

First off, I highly doubt anybody was about to dump a lot of cash into their cars off of what GALANTOWNER posted, and if they did go off of only what he said, they deserve any mishaps they encounter, second, their was no need for the insulting phrase at all, whether it was the first or the last sentence, it was not needed.

As for me being offended, I would hardly say I was offended, but more irritated than anything. I saw what you posted to Racesnos, (which happens to be a good friend of mine) about his question a couple weeks ago, which was a pretty smart assed response for a valid question, and I said nothing, I thought it was a slip up, but I see you doing it again, and a little more straitforward I get the feeling that this will become a regular occurance, even one of our newer members galant3jl12's has even noticed it. No matter how you read that sentence it sounds pretty demeaning.

As for my comment about you "thinking you know everything" I say that not as an attack against you, but more a comment on how you make yourself sound when you are talking about your car, and if you took it as an attack, I apologize.

"What is a wishbone thingy?" was a valid question? Wow, I'll be sure to take questions like that more seriously in the future. Give me a break, this is a car forum, not a daycare where everybody needs their feelings protected. :roll:

And galant3jl12 can think I'm condescending and "not very friendly" all day long, because it's the truth. Do I give a fuck what you think about me? No. Do I want to sit on this forum and give people sound advice, whether it be condescending or "not very friendly?" Yes, I do. Grow a pair and take what I say at face value rather than thinking I'm attacking somebody individually.

edit: and I call a truce - this thread would have stayed on topic had you not tried to pick a fight with me. I feel bad for the OP.

[Kwikfox]

So what you are saying is that since you have vast knowledge of your car, and you feel like you know more than anyone else here, that it gives you sound reason to act like an ass to people that may not know as much as you? Because in my mind, if everybody knew as much as you know about there cars, they wouldnt be on this forum asking questions about their car, now would they? I am by no means offended, just a little irritated thats all. The way I look at it, if someone comes and seeks you out individually, you can talk to them however you wish, but when its a valid general question or response on a public thread, the person posting does not deserve a smart assed response, unless they are trying to get smart assed responses. Only thing I am trying to say is try and be a little more respectful, becasue you might say something to someone that will tell one of the moderators. This forum is not for people who knows more about the galants to condescend, or direspect the people who are trying to learn about their cars.

Edit: I never meant to start a fight with anybody, I just made a comment on how you were treating some of the fellow members here, so to be technical, you were the one who took it into an argument. But alright, truce.

[WarmAndSCSI]

I seriously think you're about to cry over this or something.

I can put all kinds of undertones of aggression and condescendance in my posts all day long. And I hope to God it continues to irritate you.

[Kwikfox]

I seriously think you're about to cry over this or something.

I can put all kinds of undertones of aggression and condescendance in my posts all day long. And I hope to God it continues to irritate you.

HAHAHA a little pompous are we? You wish. I am just having fun with this now. I can fight all day!

[WarmAndSCSI]

I seriously think you're about to cry over this or something.

I can put all kinds of undertones of aggression and condescendance in my posts all day long. And I hope to God it continues to irritate you.

HAHAHA a litle pompous are we? You wish. I am just having fun with this now. I can fight all day!

Please. Read up a few posts and see how I asked you to stop arguing. Are you done yet?

And, on a serious note, you need to realize when you're trying to pick a fight or not. Nobody else had any problem with how I pointed out how blatantly STUPID it was to call a turbocharger a "16 lb" or "21 lb" turbo. Did it really irritate you enough to shit in this thread or were you just trying to pick a fight? I was just responding directly to bogus information that had been posted in this thread.

[Kwikfox]

Actually I was done, until you made your post about you thinking I was ready to cry over this. But whever your dont throwing shit at me, I am done. :D

[WarmAndSCSI]

Actually I was done, until you made your post about you thinking I was ready to cry over this. But whever your dont throwing shit at me, I am done. :D

That's fine. I didn't start this argument. Remember that.

[Kwikfox]

Actually, as I said before I just made a comment on your actions, i was not expecting it to break out into an argument... but since it did, I had a little fun with it, this is the last post about it from me. See you at MOD next year! :D

[WarmAndSCSI]

Actually, as I said before I just made a comment on your actions, i was not expecting it to break out into an argument... but since it did, I had a little fun with it, this is the last post about it from me.

I hope your at MOD next year so you can see my massively condescending and unfriendly personality in action. I'm sure how you perceive my posts online is a wonderful insight into my actual psyche.

And, again, sorry to the OP. Like with almost everybody else on this forum who has serious questions in well-formed sentences, you're free to PM me directly with your queries. You can join those who have found my condescending, unfriendly posts quite useful.

If you can't tell, Kwikfox, I'm being sarcastic again.

edit: and you read my mind about MOD :lol:

[6G72gearhead]

Intrawebs + anonimity = total douchebaggary.

This is the way of the internet, learn to live with it or leave.


His comment was going to get picked on by someone, the guess is who will get to it first, and who will be offended.

My turn

Maybe he was talking actual weight of the turbo, heavier turbo = bigger turbo = more boost, its science.

[WarmAndSCSI]

Maybe he was talking actual weight of the turbo, heavier turbo = bigger turbo = more boost, its science.

Too bad I already hypothesized that. I was kidding, though.

[6G72gearhead]

Maybe he was talking actual weight of the turbo, heavier turbo = bigger turbo = more boost, its science.

Too bad I already hypothesized that. I was kidding, though.

Damn, shows how much I pay attention

[Serstylz2]

u all suck balls.

[6G72gearhead]

u all suck balls.

go back in your hole.

[Serstylz2]

haiiiryy funky ones

at least offer the man some N/A mods he can do to add hp, THEN clutter his thread... kinda like i did :lol:

[WarmAndSCSI]

Wow, this thread went to absolute shit. Shame.

[kylecanthurdle]

i like apples =]

[boostzealot]

im sure if this kind of shit keeps up this thread wont even be checked by the OP. damn what a waste. its funny you know when someone gets their pussy stepped in and then they fuck a perfectly good thread up by saying how much their pussy's hurt. lets all meet in the expose the previous poster thread. see you there. oh and to the OP. like i said before it really wouldnt be a bad idea to go boost for the simple fact that horsepower to dollar ratio is much better with boost when done correctly with correctly sized turbos, adequte fuel system, and a way to tune it all. be good to yourself and boost that bitch :wink:

[duh2150]

na mods... intake and exhaust thread finished :)

[WarmAndSCSI]

na mods... intake and exhaust thread finished :)

I think I already covered the basic barrier of N/A mods for the 4G64. You can cam it sure for more power up top, but you're not going to be able to rev safely above 7000 IMO. Piston velocity is getting dangerous past that point without a fully forged, lightened, balanced lower end. It's really a platform made for boost.

It's not like a little Honda engine that can rev to the sky to make power...

[boostzealot]

na mods... intake and exhaust thread finished :)

oh god this guy again...J/K i know a little about NA mods just because i've been capitalizing on an NA motor build for about the past year. of course NA is fun and its awesome to say you kept up with something that came from the factory much faster but all in all the 64 just doesnt have it. even a stout NA motor like the nissan QR25DE does really rev much higher than my 3.5 but it makes very good low end for a 2.5L 4cyl motor. ive seen those guys get 210 personally to the wheels but thats with everything short of itbs and increasing the CR. and even in the midst of that motor the turbo guys are spending as much or less and are eclipsing that power by at least 100whp on low boost (8-9psi on the stock block).

[WarmAndSCSI]

na mods... intake and exhaust thread finished :)

oh god this guy again...J/K

Leave Aaron alone. I've been trying to smack some sense into him. :lol:

[duh2150]

na mods... intake and exhaust thread finished :)

oh god this guy again...J/K

Leave Aaron alone. I've been trying to smack some sense into him. :lol:

lol yup stock engines make 100-105 hp to the wheels :D thats alot of horsepower :shock: just think about doing your whole engine and gaining like 20 hp! from going N/A :shock: wowzers! :) lol

would you rather drop 5 grand going na and get like 50-100 hp more or pay 5 grand for a turbo and make double maby even 3 times that, i donno the prices but my concept is right :)

i wanna see a boosted 3.5L :)

[WarmAndSCSI]

na mods... intake and exhaust thread finished :)

oh god this guy again...J/K

Leave Aaron alone. I've been trying to smack some sense into him. :lol:

lol yup stock engines make 100-105 hp to the wheels :D thats alot of horsepower :shock: just think about doing your whole engine and gaining like 20 hp! from going N/A :shock: wowzers! :) lol

would you rather drop 5 grand going na and get like 50-100 hp more or pay 5 grand for a turbo and make double maby even 3 times that, i donno the prices but my concept is right :)

I don't think the 4G64 is THAT weak, but pretty close.

[kolio]

7th gens are similar 8th gens

once upon a time there was a 13 sec N/A 7th gen... cam,headers... you name it it had it




bottom line as it was said already it's alot cheaper to boost it and the gains are much better.

my 7th gen 129hp:146tq > 8th gen 108hp

[duh2150]

my 7th gen 129hp:146tq > 8th gen 108hp

well no shit a lighter car with more hp will win aginst a stock 8g.... 8g is heavy as a motha

108hp 8g galant > -8hp honda civic

thats what you just said in other words

[desertfrog]

OK I got it so go turbo, or don't do mods at all.... well hwo about droping another engine in, I was thinking of buying a crashed old Viper with the 7 litre 400 hp engine or the 7 litre GM engine from the Corvette ZO6... I have to money to do it I just want to know if it is possible... also I want to know if I could make it rear wheel drive, the Galant that is. You see I really like the way a Galant looks, I just want to suprise a few people at the lights thats all. And no one will suspect a Galant to have a v10 under the hood lol

[WarmAndSCSI]

OK I got it so go turbo, or don't do mods at all.... well hwo about droping another engine in, I was thinking of buying a crashed old Viper with the 7 litre 400 hp engine or the 7 litre GM engine from the Corvette ZO6... I have to money to do it I just want to know if it is possible... also I want to know if I could make it rear wheel drive, the Galant that is. You see I really like the way a Galant looks, I just want to suprise a few people at the lights thats all. And no one will suspect a Galant to have a v10 under the hood lol

Oooh, crazy engine swaps. DO IT! :lol: 8)

I'm sure you know how much fabrication work would be involved - the Galant's engine bay isn't even big enough, really...

[desertfrog]

will it also be possible to put it in the back seat area to make it mid engined... hmmm well I saw once a LS! engine from a covrette being dropped in an evo, so I know there will be enough space, but I think I will need to learn how to weld ect ect

[WarmAndSCSI]

Haha, if it's not your DD and you want to make something special out of it, I'm not holding you back. I've seen all kinds of small cars turned into mid-engined monsters. Just takes a lot of work and know-how.

[duh2150]

to bad that engine in the evo was in the front, i wouldnt do it or even try to do it, if you try it and you fuck up your totaly screwed, plus i like the sounds of the smaller engine, over untuned muscle, im a tuner guy, but i know what both can do

plus you can get over 400 hp with the 4g64 engine lol

[Fishboy55]

In before the inevitable lock.....

[beam514]

Oooh, crazy engine swaps. DO IT! :lol: 8)


http://www.autoblog.com/2007/04/10/ferrari-engine-served-sunny-side-up/

my favorite

[seth98esT]

If you want to stay N/A, LS1 swap! Easy hp.

[WarmAndSCSI]

to bad that engine in the evo was in the front, i wouldnt do it or even try to do it, if you try it and you fuck up your totaly screwed, plus i like the sounds of the smaller engine, over untuned muscle, im a tuner guy, but i know what both can do

plus you can get over 400 hp with the 4g64 engine lol

You prefer the farty exhaust note of an inline four over V8 muscle. God, Aaron, you're hopeless. :?

[duh2150]

no lol i perfur the rev's, id go muscle if i had a gto or like a 69 camero

its just somthing about seeing a 4 banger own a v8 lol

[anticon]

[deleted]

[6G72gearhead]

If you can make the motor sustain revs of about 8k you might reach the airflow required to make 100 hp per liter, in this case 240 at the crank. A small displacement motor in a car that weighs over 2k lbs is just not worth doing. If you want an n/a car go with a V6, and even then your just trying to keep up with Evo's and STI's. Of course an 8G V6 optioned right weighs less than either of the afformentioned cars, so 300 crank hp with a lighter car is going to go faster. Then you can add some nitrous and really have fun.

[WarmAndSCSI]

If you can make the motor sustain revs of about 8k you might reach the airflow required to make 100 hp per liter, in this case 240 at the crank. A small displacement motor in a car that weighs over 2k lbs is just not worth doing. If you want an n/a car go with a V6, and even then your just trying to keep up with Evo's and STI's. Of course an 8G V6 optioned right weighs less than either of the afformentioned cars, so 300 crank hp with a lighter car is going to go faster. Then you can add some nitrous and really have fun.

Like I said before, 8000 RPM is not safe on any 4G64 IMO. The stock rev limiter is set low for a reason. It's a shame really, but rod ratio is a bitch.

[duh2150]

i know im gonna rev liek a mother, but i probably wont make any power, im gonna put in eagle rods

[WarmAndSCSI]

i know im gonna rev liek a mother, but i probably wont make any power, im gonna put in eagle rods

How long did I spend explaining to you why this is a stupid idea? When will you learn to listen? :roll:

Have fun with a hole in your block.

[underated]

If you can make the motor sustain revs of about 8k you might reach the airflow required to make 100 hp per liter, in this case 240 at the crank. A small displacement motor in a car that weighs over 2k lbs is just not worth doing. If you want an n/a car go with a V6, and even then your just trying to keep up with Evo's and STI's. Of course an 8G V6 optioned right weighs less than either of the afformentioned cars, so 300 crank hp with a lighter car is going to go faster. Then you can add some nitrous and really have fun.

Like I said before, 8000 RPM is not safe on any 4G64 IMO. The stock rev limiter is set low for a reason. It's a shame really, but rod ratio is a bitch.

AMS and a few others recommends a rev limit of 8500 for their 2.4l kits this is do to the rod ratio being changed i think they use a 156mm rod vs the 150mm stock...

here is some info on a 2.4l

block: 4g64

bore: 86.5mm (stock)

stroke: 100mm (stroke is dictated by crank)

deck height: 6mm

cross sectional area of piston: ~5877mm^2

overall displacement: ~2.35L

rod length: 150mm (most of the time)

rod/stroke ratio: 1.5:1

piston speed:

100mm stroke at 7200rpm is 24.0 m/s

100mm stroke at 7500rpm is 25.0 m/s

100mm stroke at 7800rpm is 26.0 m/s

you most likely dont want to go over 26m/s without some custom hardware

[qnz]

when you start adding 200 hp to a car that was only meant to handle 100 hp, you start breaking other things like axles, trannys, etc.

[duh2150]

i know im gonna rev liek a mother, but i probably wont make any power, im gonna put in eagle rods

How long did I spend explaining to you why this is a stupid idea? When will you learn to listen? :roll:

Have fun with a hole in your block.

lol im fing with you lol i knew you were going to say something

[6G72gearhead]

when you start adding 200 hp to a car that was only meant to handle 100 hp, you start breaking other things like axles, trannys, etc.

Or since the platform has had a 200 hp V6 in it there is a good chance that alot of the components are designed to handle close to that hp figure.

[WarmAndSCSI]

when you start adding 200 hp to a car that was only meant to handle 100 hp, you start breaking other things like axles, trannys, etc.

You're not going to break shit @ 300 WHP unless you do something ignorant or beat on your car. The F4A42 is only slightly weaker than the F4A51 and the axles are the same.

[stolenstapler86]

anyone ever bored out a 64? if so how much over can you go safely?

[underated]

i'm at 87.5mm on my build

[duh2150]

thast becasue you honed your engine

[stolenstapler86]

what kind of pistons?

[underated]

wiseco high compression 11.5:1

[WarmAndSCSI]

thast becasue you honed your engine

Overbore != hone :roll:

[duh2150]

same thing lol stop correcting me if your boring it out your honing it also, your not gonig to bore out the cylinder into a egg shape lol, im gonna make square pistons one day lol

[laxinwarrior]

same thing lol stop correcting me if your boring it out your honing it also, your not gonig to bore out the cylinder into a egg shape lol, im gonna make square pistons one day lol

Come on, now you just sound like an asshole.... :roll:

[duh2150]

lol no im not think about how much more area you get with squares then with circles

[WarmAndSCSI]

lol no im not think about how much more area you get with squares then with circles

LOL, have fun making a square piston "ring." :lol:

Put down the pipe, man.

[duh2150]

lol yeah how am i gona figure that math out 0.0 to great for my mind!! :shock:

[6G72gearhead]

To get the greatest efficiency out of a combustion such as what happens to make your engine run, it has been proven time and time again that round is the most efficient.

[stolenstapler86]

how about some serious overbore? would it be possible to get a few hundred cc more out of the I4? might be nice in combo with that 2.6 stroker kit (if it ever turns out that it tests out okay)

[WarmAndSCSI]

Few hundred CC - as in 0.1+ L? No way. You only have 4 cylinders to work with.

[stolenstapler86]

care to elaborate? what's the maximum you could hone each cylinder to? the porche 944 had a 3.0 L i4 motor . I don't know the other specifications of the block though. I'm just curious because i haven't heard of anyone doing this.

[WarmAndSCSI]

Let's see... assume a 2mm overbore.

Stock bore = 86.5 mm. Stroke = 100 mm

Displacement = ~ 588 cc per cylinder ==> 2350 cc = 2.35 L total

Over bore = 88.5 mm. Stroke = 100 mm

Displacement = ~ 615 cc per cylinder ==> 2460 cc = 2.46 L total

An increase of 110 cc. Not bad, but 2mm overbore is significant.

[underated]

i take it back im at 88mm there is noway your going to get more then that out of the 4g64 without sacrificing the integrity of the block i have pictures somewhere i'll have to host them and get them on here

[duh2150]

what warm jsut saud we dont got a 2.4L block we got a 2.35L block lol, i think they make differnt cc blocks theres lei ak 2380cc block or somthing also

[stolenstapler86]

from what I understand that's pretty common. most of the time an auto manufacturer will just round up to the nearest nice round number. the 4g63 weighs in at 1,997 cubic centimeters but it's badged as a 2.0; I would assume that this is because A.) no one but gearheads like us give a shit about what works out to three thousandths of a liter and b.) those 3 thousandths are probably within the statistical error of the manufacturing process.

the 64 is probably badged as 2.4 cause again, no one cares about five hundreths of a liter and also because 2.35L SOHC would look awful silly cast into a valve cover :lol:

[dknight3]

lmao this thread is funny.

can sombody tell me why you would lose torque if you have a huge diameter exhaust?
cause its just not making sense to me..

[laxinwarrior]

lmao this thread is funny.

can sombody tell me why you would lose torque if you have a huge diameter exhaust?
cause its just not making sense to me..

On an N/A engine you need a certain amount of back pressure in order to get the most volumetric efficiency out of the engine. Once you increase the diameter of the exhaust you start to lower the pressure. It gets pretty complicated but on a properly tuned naturally aspirated engine, exhaust gas scavenging actually helps pull in fresh air for the next combustion cycle and with piping that is too wide it doesn't fully evacuate the cylinder of the combusted gases.

For a turbo engine, you want large diameter piping because you want as little back pressure on the turbine wheel as possible since it's restrictive and won't allow the turbo to spool as efficiently.

[WarmAndSCSI]

^^ pretty much it :D

Another thing to note is that you're going to gain top end with a larger exhaust because the engine is much more volumetrically efficient at higher RPM. You may lose low end torque as a trade off because the engine has less VE down low.

edit: this is an extremely simplified view of cause-effect, but what you need to know is that the engine needs the tuned exhaust that maintains a scavenging effect and proper exhaust gas velocity for low-end power.

[6G72gearhead]

I've always heard that backpressure is the enemy, regardless. But as everything is a trade off, backpressure is a result of a smaller diameter piping required to make velocity that makes torque. Velocity is what you want, but it comes at the cost of backpressure.

[WarmAndSCSI]

You're right, backpressure is bad but it goes hand in hand with longer and smaller diameter piping.

[dknight3]

thanks.

[duh2150]

yeah i heard backpressure was bad too, but ive heard that no back pressure is bad, i know, both are true, bigger pipe is like taking off your headers kinda.. the less backpressure the more its like leaking before your muffler kinda..,

turbos still create some backpressure, do the the fact it only has like around 8 inchs of tiping to shove a turbine and spin it so it kinda pushes aginst the valves a bit, and if you got less backpressure on the turbo it can spool faster :), but you want some pressure you spin the turbo itself,

warm correct me on my mistakes lol

[laxinwarrior]

I have a headache now. :smt021

[stolenstapler86]

I've always heard that backpressure is the enemy, regardless. But as everything is a trade off, backpressure is a result of a smaller diameter piping required to make velocity that makes torque. Velocity is what you want, but it comes at the cost of backpressure.

Read that again duh. backpressure = bad. exhaust velocity = good. If i understand this correctly it's because the higher exhaust velocity generates some kind of suction or 'scavenging' effect which pulls the burnt air/fuel mixture out of the cylinder and aids in drawing in fresh air/fuel charge. I've also heard that excessive valve overlap in combination with high exhaust velocity can actually pull some of the mixture out of the cylinder, hurting performance. correct me if i'm wrong please.

[duh2150]

but its still never good to run no backpressure just a little bit is the best , for a little 1 cylinder take the muffler off the thing it will burn it up, like flowmasters, theres always gonan be some kind of pressure in that tube no matter how you look at it

[seth98esT]

Ive posted this same thing time and time again. Backpressure is not what you get rid of when you upgrade piping. Bigger piping means bigger exhaust pulses which become farther arpart. When you have the right diameter pipe for your setup, one exhaust pulse will help pull the next one through the pipe, which means for a faster exit for the exhaust gas.

YES ITS A HONDA FORUM, READ UP!
http://www.hondacivicforum.com/m_39893/tm.htm

[6G72gearhead]

The more you kow.

[duh2150]

i dare not click on that, yeah that sounds right seth, if you ever watch a split cat back exhaust at idle, it pulses out one side usually the shorter end, sometimes out the other, ive seen like 3 pulses out the right and 1 out the left, somewhat like umm air pockets form in the tube fore about like 8 revs a puff pops out, with a split like umm matts dads car with the split catback i bet youll see that if it was pointed at the ground you would see the sand usually pulseate out at idle, if its perfect it will pulseate out one side and then the other,

i got an image in my head, like it creates a pressure bubble and after it has enoth pressure to get out the other end it shoots for it, kind of, after the pressured ball floats threw the tube it creates a slightly negitive pressure, and drags the next one along, thats what im thinking seth means, thast what im thinknig why some exhusts have a 2 tone them pressure differnaces like a "bu" and a "bo" at the same time lol

im probably completely wrong about this whole post lol, but i agree with seth! :) :mrgreen:

[WarmAndSCSI]

What Seth posted is right, but back pressure is a product of exhaust diameter and length like I said before.

Just make a hole with your hand and blow through it. It gets easier to blow through when you loosen your grip and increase the diameter, doesn't it? Same if you place both of your hands together and then shorten the path the air has to travel by removing one hand. More flow capacity = less back pressure. And back pressure creates flow restriction as you can feel with this simple demonstration.

[duh2150]

stock pipnig is fine for a reg n/a accualy i think for any n/a unless your reving to like the moon, for boring it out it should be slightly bigger, wit ha turbo you wnt it way wideer the an 1/8 an inch, do to the fact it shoves a ton of air into the engine, a ton of air has to come out, make more pressure in the same tubing, and too pressure much is always bad and you lose lots of performance and bog down, like and this goes for alot of things it just bepends on how you look at it
"you cant shove 10 pounds of crap in a 5 pound bag"
so you have to get a second bag, or big a 10 pound bag, in this case you can find a way to make 2 small pipings or just make it larger, same goes for intake you cant suck 100 cfm threw a 5 cfm hole, thats why you buy a turbo, but still cant shove it in there fast enoth under higher conditions

[WarmAndSCSI]

Stock piping isn't good because it has tons of restrictions. Just look at it. However, mandrel bent 2.25" piping with a free-flowing cat and muffler would be ideal for a 2.4L N/A setup.

[duh2150]

well i mean a stock n/a lol its made for the car, porbably change the muffler and chhange ot uthe cat, and it would be set for a stock engine

[WarmAndSCSI]

Yes, it's made for the car, but Mitsubishi has to cut corners to keep costs down. IE: the pipe bends SUCK and you'd benefit from a mandrel-bent system even on a stock 4G64.

[duh2150]

true but i mean do the same size piping is stock a little bit wider for a blown out n/a, plus if your gonan widen it you gotta widen everything on the exahust including headers and shit, everything smaller then what you widened will create some kind of pressure change at that spot, for instance gonig 3 inch from headers to the stock muffler it will do no good

higher pressure form the engine then to a lower pressure tubing(aka widened) if widening it widin the whole thing from the edges of the header that touch the engine to the tip on the muffler

[6G72gearhead]

The fewer bends you have the less restriction with smaller pipeing. A well thought out exhaust system would ideally use the fewest bends to get the gasses out from under the car, while using a pipeing tuned to the powerband of the engine.

[duh2150]

yeah to big is bad is what im trying to say