7g o2 sensor

[4g64terror]

Anyone out there know if either one of the 7g o2 sensors are wide band like a honda or subaru? I need the FOR SURE awnser so i know if i have to get the wideband with my a/f guage or not

[manybrews]

define "wide band".


because in all my years of working on cars, this is the first time ive heard that statement.
O2 sensors by design max their output at about 1 volt.

[4g64terror]

if u dont know the difference between a wide band o2 and one thats not then u arent who i need to be talking to..a wide band o2 has a greater range of measurability than a standard one..it can read air fuel ratios from the bottom of the scale to the top instead of just a few volts right in the middle

[RMG612]

what kind of a/f guage?

[BEAST]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(4g64terror)</div><div class='quotemain'>if u dont know the difference between a wide band o2 and one thats not then u arent who i need to be talking to..</div>
Actually he would probably know more about it than any of us, he is a Mitsubishi Tech. and has been for what Manybrews 11 years now?

[4g64terror]

then he should know what a wideband o2 is...i mean it is a pretty basic term.. probably im gonna use an autometer air fuel guage

[JiP]

I am pretty sure its not wideband. And Manybrews is the man when it come to Mitsu's considering he's been working for them for years.

[RMG612]

then unless you have a broken 02 sensor you need to replace it doesnt matter

all you need to do is wire it up assuming you use the autometer guage

[4g64terror]

dude i KNOW what im talking about...it has nothing to do with the sensor being bad..any of u know someone with a ford that has an autometer air fuel guage? if u do go watch it sometime...it bounces around so much u can get any kind of reading off the guage..this is due to the fact that the ford o2 isnt wideband...thats why im trying to find out of mine is or not...im not gonna get the guage unless we have one

[RMG612]

like i said all you need to do is wire it up.

i know because i have one in my car.

[manybrews]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(4g64terror)</div><div class='quotemain'>if u dont know the difference between a wide band o2 and one thats not then u arent who i need to be talking to..a wide band o2 has a greater range of measurability than a standard one..it can read air fuel ratios from the bottom of the scale to the top instead of just a few volts right in the middle</div>
umm... ALL O2 sensors read from 0 volts to about 900 mv.
that it. there are no "wideband" sensors that read anything else on american cars.


and ALL O2 sensors "bounce around". the systems are, and always HAVE BEEN designed to crosscount about 5 to 10 times a second.
there are none that just sit in the middle.

[JiP]

There are Wideband o2 sensors 0-5v outputs not 0-1 so there not for stock ECM. They are more precise then stock o2 and normally for aftermarket controllers like Haltech, AEM.

I have read that for tuning purposes with stock ECM's you would weld a second bung on your downpipe and install the wideband o2 that just sits there only to be used by your dyno tuners equiptment to get acurate readings, or you can do the same and buy an aftermarket wideband o2 gauge, but you'll still need your stock o2 sensor for your ECM.

[manybrews]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JiP)</div><div class='quotemain'>There are Wideband o2 sensors 0-5v outputs not 0-1 so there not for stock ECM. Â*They are more precise then stock o2 and normally for aftermarket controllers like Haltech, AEM. Â*

.</div>

hell, it wouldnt make any difference. Percentage wise, the numbers will corelate exactly. meaning .5 volts on a normal sensor would probably equate to 2.5 volts on one of these aftermarket "wide" sensors, thereby eliminating its usefullness as a device.

more than likely, these sensors are just normal O2 sensors with voltage amplifying circuits installed that increases output by x amount.

[JiP]

Your right. Its more like steps in analog to digital conversion for you electronics geeks) 128bit is much better then 8bit. You have more precision, but basically its all relative.

[o0 XeRO G 0o]

dont you guys hate it when somebody gets on the board and automatically has a bad attitude towards everyone? i hate that :doubleup:

[JiP]

o2 is SUPOSED to bounce around in closed loop mode. The ECM is constant adjusting a/f ratio based on its reading on its last reading of the o2, and lets say the ECM operates at a conservative 10mhz, that means along with its other duties its sampling probably 50,000 times a second and performing adjustments, you think your gonna see the o2 steady?

Its steady only at openloop mode wich for the most part is when your flooring it. A wideband o2 will fluctate also in closed loop mode because its closed loop ECM is adjusting not just blindly dumping fuel like it pretty much does in open loop.

[JiP]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(X7eyeHATEyou7X)</div><div class='quotemain'>dont you guys hate it when somebody gets on the board and automatically has a bad attitude towards everyone? Â*i hate that Â*:doubleup:</div>

This from the man with the name "I hate you" LMAO everytime I see your name and that avatar I crack up laughing. Good job! :laughing: :laughing:

[krazienluv10]

hehe true huh....

[4g64terror]

oh my god manybrews it has nothing to do with frequency...it reads from a certain air fuel ratio to another..some can only go in a narrow band some can go in a wide band...why do u think horiba air fuel meters are 1000 dollars huh? because they use WIDEBAND o2 sensors...i dont have a bad attitude i just hate misinformation

[4g64terror]

and as far as the meter being steady i know its steady at wide open throttle if u have an air fuel guage and bounces around at part throttle..just go watch one on a mustang or lightning then youll know what im talking about

[4g64terror]

and as far as the meter being steady i know its steady at wide open throttle if u have an air fuel guage and bounces around at part throttle..just go watch one on a mustang or lightning then youll know what im talking about

[4g64terror]

hey eye hate u i checke dout the pics of your car..i dig white ones...thats the good ole ebay trunk mod...got a list of exactly what u bought to do it? the instructions are too vauge

[JiP]

You dont need a wideband o2 its not going to do anything for you and just end it there. It isnt going to do anything for you except make you do is waste some cash and a lot more work to install a THIRD o2 sensor and seperate meter for what? Get a digital a/f guage not the boucy light one and use ur stock sensor readings they are more acurate then you may think.

[manybrews]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(4g64terror)</div><div class='quotemain'>oh my god manybrews it has nothing to do with frequency...it reads from a certain air fuel ratio to another..some can only go in a narrow band some can go in a wide band...why do u think horiba air fuel meters are 1000 dollars huh? Â*because they use WIDEBAND o2 sensors...i dont have a bad attitude Â* i just hate misinformation</div>
you dont seem to know what im talking about, and i certainly have no idea what youre talking about, being as your posts are kind of incomplete..

regardless. There is no "misinformation" here. youre asking strange questions in which you give no definition of your terms, and expect people to know what youre talking about?

look, i not sure you really know how an O2 sensor works in relation to an automobile. There are NO manufacturers using any type of "wideband" O2 sensors on any car in america, as by physical makeup an O2 sensor as we know it is incapable of delivering more than about a volt. period.

adding voltage amplifiers to the circuitry would be pointless, as it would be no more accurate than a standard sensor. It would just have a higher output.

to end all this, you do NOT have a "wideband" oxygen sensor on your galant. Its maximum output is about 1 volt.

[4g64terror]

Both zirconia and titania oxygen sensors have been installed in USA vehicles for about 20 years. Their purpose is generally known by those who professionally deal with tune-ups and emissions.

Honda introduced the wide band oxygen sensor in the early 1990's. NTK (an NGK Spark Plugs Company) produced the Honda version, with agreements that availability would be limited to Honda dealerships.

There are wideband oxygen sensor versions available in the aftermarket.

I would be more than willing to offer information about any oxygen sensor (zirconia, titania, and wide band).

NGKAZ
NGKAZ
NGK SPARK PLUG (USA), INC.
should i keep going? i can send more if u want

[4g64terror]

Common AFR Meters
Common dash mounted AFR meters make use of one, three or four wire factory installed oxygen sensors which are incapable of providing a wideband output. These sensors, by design, will read a high voltage with an air/fuel mixture below stoichiometric (14.7:1) and a low voltage above this point. Outside this narrow operating range, the meter has no way of accurately and reliably differentiating between 12:1 and 13:1, or conversely, 15:1 and 18:1. These readings are also greatly affected by exhaust gas temperature and sensor location. A 2:1 ratio variation is not uncommon. It is important to remember that automobile manufacturers installed these sensors to maintain a stoichiometric (14.7:1) mixture under cruising conditions, as this is the point where optimum catalytic converter efficiency is achieved.
courtesy of fjo enterprises..check out some of the stuff on there
http://www.fjoinc.com/automotive/index.htm ('http://www.fjoinc.com/automotive/index.htm')

[4g64terror]

i guess that didn't end it https://www.thegalantcenter.org/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif https://www.thegalantcenter.org/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif https://www.thegalantcenter.org/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif https://www.thegalantcenter.org/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif https://www.thegalantcenter.org/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif https://www.thegalantcenter.org/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif https://www.thegalantcenter.org/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

[4g64terror]

here is an actual link to super street installing one on an Si civic
http://www.superstreetonline.com/techartic...1518/index.html ('http://www.superstreetonline.com/techarticles/61518/index.html')

[manybrews]

thats a lot of fancy "cutting and pasting", but you actually posted exactly what i said.

that no american car is using any "wide-band" O2 sensors. The Honda incident is for one of their special lean-burn cars, no longer sold in america.

there is no reason to currently install such a sensor in any american car due to our emission regulations and fuel control systems, hence the reason the manufacturers dont need to publish information about them.


and trust me, i know all about how an O2 sensor works without having to search the net.

[4g64terror]

i was just showing you proof of what a wide band is mister ive never heard of one...man u just dont know when to say when do ya? THATS exactly why i dont trust dealers with performace applications...stick to installing those little factory air filters and such and quit trying to denounce someone as if you're smarter..ya might learn a thing or two :shock:

[JiP]

I happen to own a plot of land on the moon interested in purchasing it from me?

I know how a wideband o2 works, and the difference between it and a normal o2. Are you planning on building a 500+hp DSM? Are you running 30lbs of boost and 850cc injectors? You dont need a wideband o2.

[manybrews]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(4g64terror)</div><div class='quotemain'>i was just showing you proof of what a wide band is mister ive never heard of one...man u just dont know when to say when do ya? Â*THATS exactly why i dont trust dealers with performace applications...stick to installing those little factory air filters and such and quit trying to denounce someone as if you're smarter..ya might learn a thing or two :shock:</div>

you know what actually funny? that you or ANYONE would tune an engine using ANY O2 sensor, wideband or not.

have fun spending the cash on something as useless as an air/fuel meter, because those of us in the know would never use anything less than an actual gas analyzer to do that.

any speed shop mapping fuel trims with an O2 sensor isnt worth a dime.

[4g64terror]

oh and as far as american sold cars tell that to my buddy with a 2001 subaru 2.5RS with a 2003 wrx swap done..DEALER INSTALLED 165 hours of wiring labor and from the 18 year veteran subaru tech's mouth"i went ahead and hooked up your air fuel guage to your second oxygen sensor..they are wide band so your guage will be spot on

[manybrews]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(4g64terror)</div><div class='quotemain'>oh and as far as american sold cars tell that to my buddy with a 2001 subaru 2.5RS with a 2003 wrx swap done..DEALER INSTALLED 165 hours of wiring labor and from the 18 year veteran subaru tech's mouth"i went ahead and hooked up your air fuel guage to your second oxygen sensor..they are wide band so your guage will be spot on</div>
well, gosh! i thought dealers werent worth a shit when it comes to performance.

i guess i would call that "hypocritical" to say you wouldnt trust them, but then use that as an example.

[4g64terror]

with the combination of a wide band oxygen sensor and an EGT guage you CANT GET ANYMORE ACCURATE..W.T.F. do you think DYNOJET uses widebands on ALL of their dynos??? i guess now dyno jet doesnt know what they are talking about...or anyone who uses one? which lets see is just about everyone

[4g64terror]

notice i said MY BUDDY'S SUBARU

[JiP]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(4g64terror)</div><div class='quotemain'>i was just showing you proof of what a wide band is mister ive never heard of one...man u just dont know when to say when do ya? Â*THATS exactly why i dont trust dealers with performace applications...stick to installing those little factory air filters and such and quit trying to denounce someone as if you're smarter..ya might learn a thing or two :shock:</div>

When it comes to Mitsubishi cars I could pretty much guarantee Many knows more then most of us. He may not know everysingle stupid performance item, and may not agree with half of my glue and tape methods of fixing things..but I still respect his input, I know he knwos what he is talking about because its his profession. It still remains that your just going to waste money on this if you buy it. Its not gona make u fast and furious. :roll: https://www.thegalantcenter.org/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif

[manybrews]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(4g64terror)</div><div class='quotemain'>with the combination of a wide band oxygen sensor and an EGT guage you CANT GET ANYMORE ACCURATE..W.T.F. do you think DYNOJET uses widebands on ALL of their dynos??? i guess now dyno jet doesnt know what they are talking about...or anyone who uses one? which lets see is just about everyone</div>
yes, you can. you use an actual 5 gas analyzer, like a real speed shop would.
see, the O2 level is not the only gas to watch. HC, N, CO, and CO2 are as important if not moreso.

but i forgot.. with the 1 car or so that youve worked on (compared to the 9000 or so i have), you probably know your stuff.

[4g64terror]

and they actually have a separate wing at the dealership for nothing but performance so its just not some oil changing grease monkey runnin around spoutin out shit on stuff he doesnt know about

[manybrews]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(4g64terror)</div><div class='quotemain'>and they actually have a separate wing at the dealership for nothing but performance so its just not some oil changing grease monkey runnin around spoutin out shit on stuff he doesnt know about</div>
funny, we kinda got a few cars like that, too.

ever heard of any of them?
the starion
the cordia turbo
the mirage turbo
the eclipse turbo
the 3000 GT (twin turbo, of course)
the lancer EVO.

none of these are popular to hot rod, are they? Im sure ive never made 300 HP eclipses or starions..

[JiP]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(4g64terror)</div><div class='quotemain'>oh and as far as american sold cars tell that to my buddy with a 2001 subaru 2.5RS with a 2003 wrx swap done..DEALER INSTALLED 165 hours of wiring labor and from the 18 year veteran subaru tech's mouth"i went ahead and hooked up your air fuel guage to your second oxygen sensor..they are wide band so your guage will be spot on</div>

Why would you monitor second bank o2 sensor? Thats for emmisions purposes to make sure your cats are working. To far into the exhaust stream to read anything useful

[manybrews]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JiP)</div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(4g64terror)</div><div class='quotemain'>oh and as far as american sold cars tell that to my buddy with a 2001 subaru 2.5RS with a 2003 wrx swap done..DEALER INSTALLED 165 hours of wiring labor and from the 18 year veteran subaru tech's mouth"i went ahead and hooked up your air fuel guage to your second oxygen sensor..they are wide band so your guage will be spot on</div>

Why would you monitor second bank o2 sensor? Thats for emmisions purposes to make sure your cats are working. To far into the exhaust stream to read anything useful</div>
its also totally inaccurate, as its monitoring the catalytic effect of the converters.

He could be speaking of the banks individually, though... Ill grant him that. The boxer 4 would have 4 O2s on it as its technically a 2 bank engine.

[4g64terror]

who the hell cares about those other gassses unless your testing for emmisions if u think how much carbon dioxide your puttin out then YOURE the one who doesnt know what your talkin about...seems like the 9000 cars youve worked on didnt teach u much about going fast...oh youre right i only have one car OF MINE that i work on other than the 7g..its got about 8 cylinders 600 horses..stand alone EEC tuner and runs 9's BUT WELL FORGET ABOUT THE HONDAS, MITSUS, GRAND NATIONALS, MUSTANGS, CAMAROS, SUPRAS OF ALL OF MY BUDDIES THAT IVE DONE.. what about you?

[JiP]

I heard if you take a stick of bigred and chew it up real good then wrap it around your o2 sensor it becomes wideband. Give it a shot! Guarantee 20hp increase!

[4g64terror]

youre wasting your time dude this all started with a wideband question next time just say something like "im pretty sure mitsus dont have one" instead of trying to prove someone wrong with an army of information proving you wrong

[4g64terror]

whatever JiP coming from a guy that thinks a throttle body is a big mod i dont really need to hear anything

[JiP]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(4g64terror)</div><div class='quotemain'>who the hell cares about those other gassses unless your testing for emmisions Â*if u think how much carbon dioxide your puttin out then YOURE the one who doesnt know what your talkin about...seems like the 9000 cars youve worked on didnt teach u much about going fast...oh youre right i only have one car OF MINE Â*that i work on other than the 7g..its got about 8 cylinders 600 horses..stand alone EEC tuner and runs 9's Â* BUT WELL FORGET ABOUT THE HONDAS, MITSUS, GRAND NATIONALS, MUSTANGS, CAMAROS, SUPRAS OF ALL OF MY BUDDIES THAT IVE DONE.. Â* what about you?</div>

I'll have you know I recently completed work on a Delorean outputting 1.21 jigawats of power. Top that!

[manybrews]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(4g64terror)</div><div class='quotemain'>who the hell cares about those other gassses unless your testing for emmisions Â*if u think how much carbon dioxide your puttin out then YOURE the one who doesnt know what your talkin about..</div>
your ignorance is overwhelming. the CO2 reading is one of the most important readings on any car, as its in direct relation to the combustion effieciency of any particular engine.
i dont think ill waste my time explaining the rest, as you obviously arent going to listen.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>
.seems like the 9000 cars youve worked on didnt teach u much about going fast...oh youre right i only have one car OF MINE Â*that i work on other than the 7g..its got about 8 cylinders 600 horses..stand alone EEC tuner and runs 9's Â* BUT WELL FORGET ABOUT THE HONDAS, MITSUS, GRAND NATIONALS, MUSTANGS, CAMAROS, SUPRAS OF ALL OF MY BUDDIES THAT IVE DONE.. Â* what about you?</div>
sure thing, buddy.

youve hotrodded all those cars, but couldnt figure out something like a factory O2 sensor on a galant.

my need to prove things to you just disappeared with your last line of bull.
bye bye then!

[4g64terror]

your cars still an automatic right? get back to me when youve swapped a 5 speed in..i just finshed mine

[manybrews]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JiP)</div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(4g64terror)</div><div class='quotemain'>who the hell cares about those other gassses unless your testing for emmisions Â*if u think how much carbon dioxide your puttin out then YOURE the one who doesnt know what your talkin about...seems like the 9000 cars youve worked on didnt teach u much about going fast...oh youre right i only have one car OF MINE Â*that i work on other than the 7g..its got about 8 cylinders 600 horses..stand alone EEC tuner and runs 9's Â* BUT WELL FORGET ABOUT THE HONDAS, MITSUS, GRAND NATIONALS, MUSTANGS, CAMAROS, SUPRAS OF ALL OF MY BUDDIES THAT IVE DONE.. Â* what about you?</div>

I'll have you know I recently completed work on a Delorean outputting 1.21 jigawats of power. Top that!</div>
CRAP! i had to run a lightning bolt into mine to accomplish that.

[JiP]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(4g64terror)</div><div class='quotemain'>whatever JiP Â*coming from a guy that thinks a throttle body is a big mod i dont really need to hear anything</div>

The big deal is that no one else could get it to work without swapping ecu's except me. And the 40 emails I've gotten in the past couple weeks shows people are interested. Atleast that IS an actualy performance mod. Besides I dont have to prove to you, if you want to run off and waste time and money be my guest.


In fact I'm asking moderators to completely delete this topic this is just nonsense now.

[4g64terror]

theres nothing to figure out either it has one or it doesnt...i figured TGC is one of the few galant sites where u can find out stuff on a car youre just getting into but i see that its just like most of em...theres some jackass know it all tech on there who everyone sucks his dick giving misinformation and downing anyone who thinks other than him...my point is before we started this conversation u had no idea what a wideband o2 sensor was and now u do...nuff said

[manybrews]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(4g64terror)</div><div class='quotemain'>theres nothing to figure out either it has one or it doesnt...i figured TGC is one of the few galant sites where u can find out stuff on a car youre just getting into but i see that its just like most of em...theres some jackass know it all tech on there who everyone sucks his dick giving misinformation and downing anyone who thinks other than him...my point is before we started this conversation u had no idea what a wideband o2 sensor was and now u do...nuff said</div>

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.


keep in mind who the orignal asshole was..

that'd be YOU!
buh-bye then.





by the way, i havent given out any misinformation yet.

[4g64terror]

i tell ya what Jip now my 7g is a 5 speed im gettin ready to turbo charge it ill be done by the end of the month..ill SHOW u a mod. in the form of a 14b with a 7cm exhaust housing

[JiP]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(4g64terror)</div><div class='quotemain'>i tell ya what Jip now my 7g is a 5 speed im gettin ready to turbo charge it Â* ill be done by the end of the month..ill SHOW u a mod. in the form of a 14b with a 7cm exhaust housing</div>

I have a 14b currently being rebuilt and ported, 2.0 1g dohc head that as we speak I am cleaning getting it ready to be sent to the shop to get decked to be put on in about 3 months. And to top my list, my company is working on creating a standalone ignition system addon for stock galant ECU to swap to DIS and give you full control of timming and getting rid of the shit distributer which will probably not work with more then 5psi boost if even and the system will save you hundreds in new ecu and installation pains.

You underestimate other peoples knowledge and ability because your hardheaded. I'm not even responding anymore.

[seth98esT]

wow :shocked2:
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid51/p0dddc248c0f3f5e6bb35a625b1e9125a/fc9fa8b8.jpg
:laughing:

on a side not, that sounds really interesting JiP...id buy it if it was reasonable priced, heck id probably buy it no matter what! sounds like a great idea!

[Tiptronic]

i was asked to take a look at this and make a call. heres the call: 4g64terror, you have a total of 30 posts, 23 of which you spent on this one thread. i know everyone is entitled to their opinion, but come on dude, there more on this site that o2 sensors.

broaden your horizons....TOPIC CLOSED!!