uhhhh timing belt (i think)

[dGALANTc]

well this morning my lady went to start the car came and told me the batt was dead. so i went down to do the charging thing and crank crank no start... hmmm i wonder whats going on since it was fine the night before.
took off the timing belt cover (top) and told her to crank one more time.

crank but the timing belt wasnt spinning. making a slightly educated assumtion that the belt is broken or slipped but im not 100%. and is it even possible to break a timing belt simply cranking the engine ive never heard of that if so would i still be looking at having valve damage. conformation and advice needed. thanks guys.

another thing is i was intending to do the dohc swap eventually wondering would now be the time. would it be any easier. since im already taking a lot off.

2002
2.4L

[reiketsutsukigami]

is it turning over at least? and if its the belt it would at least pull the other half of the belt down i mean its unlikely the belt would snap in two places.

[warren]

Try to turn the turn the crank yourself because you motor maybe locked which thats bad

[dGALANTc]

thats all it does is turn over and the cranking gets slower and slower as you hold it.. yea confuses the hell outta me why its not pulling it around but i grabbed it at the top and couldnt pull it either. im going to start ripping it apart later when someone is here to watch my daughter. then maybe i can see whats going on

[4g63lover]

If the top end isnt moving while you are trying to start it, the top and bottom of the engine isnotconnected to eachother. Further inspect other places of the belt to see if it is tangled somewhere preventing you to pull the belt out.

I would get ready to get some cash together to rebuild the motor or R&R the engine.

[dGALANTc]

Try to turn the turn the crank yourself because you motor maybe locked which thats bad

motors not locked cranks spins thanks though


If the top end isnt moving while you are trying to start it, the top and bottom of the engine isnotconnected to eachother. Further inspect other places of the belt to see if it is tangled somewhere preventing you to pull the belt out.

I would get ready to get some cash together to rebuild the motor or R&R the engine.

thats what i was thinking... thanks... when i take a closer look ill post more info.

[dGALANTc]

couldnt get much more info on it today... got caught up in some mess ill fill in the blanks tomorrow.

[keith6110]

If the timing belt is spinning when you crank and it still doesn't start, chances are you have no compression as valves could be bent. Yes a simple crank can do this if the belt were to slip. I would try to eliminate some stupid stuff first. Examples being; does it spark or is it getting gas? If you're fuel pump went bad in combination with a dead battery (excessive starting without gas) then maybe thats the problem. I would just try a compression test first and see what the results are. If you get 0 on any of them or even numbers under 100, I would assume the timing belt slipped.

Good luck on the diagnostics.

[dGALANTc]

If the timing belt is spinning when you crank and it still doesn't start, chances are you have no compression as valves could be bent. Yes a simple crank can do this if the belt were to slip. I would try to eliminate some stupid stuff first. Examples being; does it spark or is it getting gas? If you're fuel pump went bad in combination with a dead battery (excessive starting without gas) then maybe thats the problem. I would just try a compression test first and see what the results are. If you get 0 on any of them or even numbers under 100, I would assume the timing belt slipped.

Good luck on the diagnostics.

timing belt doesnt spin, the cam isnt spinning, or better yet the top half of the motor is not doing anything.im almost positive its the belt. but idk how to do the compression test. well time to research that. and thanks for the good luck wishes

[dGALANTc]

what would cause it to crank slowly.... i thought if the timing belt went it would crank faster?

still havent had time to do a lot of looking but it really doesnt seem good. it is bugging me that i cant really look at the thing i have no time.

[dGALANTc]

i turned the cam sprocket with a wrench and the timing belt still seems to be in tact would the balance shaft cause these problems. so i tried to start it again just to see what would happen and it just clicks like crazy.... starter??? idk why but im lost i thought i knew more about cars than this...lol guess im still a newbie/noob. Any help??

[Galantman03]

well if the battery clicks, you probably killed it from trying to crank it to many times, so your battery will be dead. but just because the timing belt is on, doesnt mean the timing is correct, if could have skipped some teeth that morning when she tried to start it, then you going out there and cranking it, it bent the valve, so it wont start now that you have no compression...... but i think your battery needs to be charged

[dGALANTc]

battery probably is dead i guess im kinda in a panic since it is my dd and i have a car to go anywhere. i am really thinking the worst though. and i hate to think that way but..... i really just need to spend some quality time with it. ive been trying to keep an eye on a 3 yr old and diagnose a car at the same time not very productive at all.

[seth98esT]

Put a chalk mark on the tbelt, turn the crank until the chalk mark comes back around, that way you know the tbelt is intact. If it is, then I would look at the starter and/or battery. If the tbelt isnt spinning at all, then the starter or battery is the culprit.

If it just clicks when you try to start, Id have the battery tested first. If it tests fine, have your starter tested.

[dGALANTc]

Put a chalk mark on the tbelt, turn the crank until the chalk mark comes back around, that way you know the tbelt is intact. If it is, then I would look at the starter and/or battery. If the tbelt isnt spinning at all, then the starter or battery is the culprit.

If it just clicks when you try to start, Id have the battery tested first. If it tests fine, have your starter tested.

ill try that tomoro morn thanks. i hope it is something simple or at least i hope i dont need a whole new motor or rebuild.

[dGALANTc]

well i figured out what the problem was.... the teeth on my timing belt are gone on a spot in the belt.... evidence below





http://i867.photobucket.com/albums/ab236/dgcimme/STUFF032.jpg
http://i867.photobucket.com/albums/ab236/dgcimme/STUFF028.jpg
http://i867.photobucket.com/albums/ab236/dgcimme/STUFF031.jpg
http://i867.photobucket.com/albums/ab236/dgcimme/STUFF027.jpg

any suggestions or advice is appreciated im guessing new motor or rebuild but idk which...

[dGALANTc]

bump for pics... lol

[SkylineG1]

Well you said nothing is turning. And the belt is not broken....hmmmm. I say chage the belt then do a compression test.

[dGALANTc]

i guess that would be a good start... thanks for the input guys i appreciate it

[dGALANTc]

well if anyone cares lol ive decided to just replace the engine keep this old one and rebuild it to make some power. we shall see how it goes when i get some cash to take care of it all. thanks again for the input guys...

[skrap]

If its your DD it would be better and more time efficient to just replace the belt..

[dGALANTc]

well im almost positive there is internal damage if i replace the belt abd it didnt work i would be looking at replacing the engine, so i decided to eliminate a step.

but that could change if i find there is no valve damage i just dont know hot to check that without taking off the head or replacing the belt... so ill be searching for a new engine while i tear it apart until i find out for sure about the valves.

[reiketsutsukigami]

im pretty sure a compression test will let you know if theres valve damage.

[warren]

well you have the same problem has my brothers eclipse ok open the oil and look inside we did a compression test nothing found out one piston was broken all apart

[dGALANTc]

im pretty sure a compression test will let you know if theres valve damage.

it is to my understanding (may be wrong) that the timing belt must be in working order to do a valid compression test.


well you have the same problem has my brothers eclipse ok open the oil and look inside we did a compression test nothing found out one piston was broken all apart

Are you saying drain the oil and look for metal or take off the oil pan?

[warren]

yes sir we took the eclipse motor apart and some piston are broken

[skrap]

Listen man, This will be the most simple and cheapest way to figure this out.. I skipped mt T belt and I had no internal damage at all.. So what you do is order a new timing belt.. Put it on and make sure that you have it timmed correctly and then run a compression test.. When you get a JY motor you are running a risk of getting a motor that is going to go bad anyway.. Also you will need to replace the T belt on that motor also. So if you get it now to trty and save the motor you have and it ends up being damaged atleast you have a new T belt for the JY motor..

[dGALANTc]

yes sir we took the eclipse motor apart and some piston are broken

im gonna change the oil anyway so i guess i could take a look and see


Listen man, This will be the most simple and cheapest way to figure this out.. I skipped mt T belt and I had no internal damage at all.. So what you do is order a new timing belt.. Put it on and make sure that you have it timmed correctly and then run a compression test.. When you get a JY motor you are running a risk of getting a motor that is going to go bad anyway.. Also you will need to replace the T belt on that motor also. So if you get it now to trty and save the motor you have and it ends up being damaged atleast you have a new T belt for the JY motor..

makes sense and i understand what your saying so that may be what ill do to make sure idk why but for some reason i kept thinking changing everything like waterpump, tensioners, etc. but i could in fact just throw the belt itself on to see if there is internal damage. ill do this this weekend.

[skrap]

Just be carful and make sure it is correctly timmed.. To have an experienced member by you? If so you might want to see if they can drop over and make sure its timmed right.. Goodluck.. Pm me if you need any thing..

[dGALANTc]

will do thanks for the help

[dGALANTc]

checked everything i could and it seems im looking at a new engine or rebuild but money is really tight due to some current unfortunate events and ive been thinking about selling, this is a last resort though i dont want to sell my baby. but unless i can have it fixed sooner than later thats what ill have to do. any opinions should i sell and just buy another one later or should i go ahead and scrap the money and try to rebuild myself. it would be my first time rebuilding a motor but i honestly think i can if i had help. anything you guys could tell me im appreciative.

[warren]

so what did happen

[dGALANTc]

the valves were bent. got no compression on 2 cyl

[galant4life]

same exact story happened to me last nit . my mechanic came over and checked it,,timing belt slipped and i had the car towed this morning to see if the engine is any good

[dGALANTc]

yea it happens but i had planned on replacing mine the next weekend... if it just slipped you may be ok

[spdracr]

replacing what ?? the whole engine ?? no need for that. my belt was losing teeth slowly and it ended up going out while driving, i had all 8 valve on the same side ( intake or exhaust im not sure ) bent so i sent it out to the machine shop and got all 8 replaced and other 8 cut and got a timing belt and head gasket and new bolts

machine shop cost me $230 and the rest of the parts arent that much

so unless u have damage on your pistons i dont see a need to replace the motor