noob to engine internals

[dGALANTc]

i had no idea where to post this question so i guess this is an ok spot for it.

im in the middle of a head removal to replace it but i had a question. i read somewhere that you can tell if the valves are bent by looking at them when the rockers are removed, by looking at the top of them poking out of the springs. is this true? i met a guy that said he could do a compression test so i had him do it and he said it was bad compression so i assumed bent valves. but i was calling him for the numbers and he said he forgot all of them so idk if i can trust what he says. i wouldve been there but i had an interview and that was the only time he said he could do it, another thing that seemed iffy.
i really think the guy was jerking with me as he kept asking to change the head for 500 and of course i said no. just well long story short if all the valves look the same height does that mean that they are not bent. i remember reading it somewhere but im asking you guys to kinda get your experiences with this type stuff since i am what the title says. anything helps thanks.

sorry for the book!

[mrg7243]

i know when my valve were tested,(i did not break my timing belt just headgasket) he stuck them in a lather, turned it on and if you see it wobble then it is bent, but if it spins full circle then is not.

[dGALANTc]

i know when my valve were tested,(i did not break my timing belt just headgasket) he stuck them in a lather, turned it on and if you see it wobble then it is bent, but if it spins full circle then is not.

ok so he removed them from the head put them in a ?lather? sounds like soap or some sort of machine lol.

[Galantman03]

^he ment lathe.... a wood lathe, like carving a bat or a cup. you can turn a 2x4 into a wood dowel.... what I would do... is take the head off, inspect the all the valves, and see which ones look visually different, and if your up to it, take them out, and take out 1 known good valve, and compare them by setting the valve on the side, and roll it... see which ones wooble.... samething as putting them on a lathe, but you probably don't have one lol....

[reiketsutsukigami]

sorry i havent gotten around to weighing my head or checkin shipping yet for ya ive been busy fixin my ride got it just about good again so ill check asap for ya.

[dGALANTc]

^he ment lathe.... a wood lathe, like carving a bat or a cup. you can turn a 2x4 into a wood dowel.... what I would do... is take the head off, inspect the all the valves, and see which ones look visually different, and if your up to it, take them out, and take out 1 known good valve, and compare them by setting the valve on the side, and roll it... see which ones wooble.... samething as putting them on a lathe, but you probably don't have one lol....

oh a lathe now i got it i know what that is lol. yea i guess i may as well remove the head anyway im soooooo close to getting it off. wouldnt you have to remove the valve springs to get the valves out? im sure they dont just slide out right.


sorry i havent gotten around to weighing my head or checkin shipping yet for ya ive been busy fixin my ride got it just about good again so ill check asap for ya.

all good i havent even found out for sure if ill get it anyway it all really depends on how my interview goes tomorrow. if i find out anything i wil pm you. so no rush you can wait until i say for sure if you want.

[Galant306m]

Best way to see if you have bad valves, take the head off and remove the cam, this will allow all of the valves to close completely. Now get a decent size glass of water and dump it down each intake and exhaust port if you have any leaks from a valve it is bent or not seating properly.

[dGALANTc]

Best way to see if you have bad valves, take the head off and remove the cam, this will allow all of the valves to close completely. Now get a decent size glass of water and dump it down each intake and exhaust port if you have any leaks from a valve it is bent or not seating properly.

sounds like a plan and seeing that you know your stuff and live maybe 20 miles from me i may be having a mini meet at my apartment soon lol j/k. but seriously if you dont mind meeting a new person im new to the area and could use a gear head buddy.

[Galantman03]

yeah you do need a vavle spring compressor... the water isn't that bad of an idea... i would deff do that... then you only have to remove your known bad ones..

[Galant306m]

sounds like a plan and seeing that you know your stuff and live maybe 20 miles from me i may be having a mini meet at my apartment soon lol j/k. but seriously if you dont mind meeting a new person im new to the area and could use a gear head buddy.

Oh shits lol did not see that you where from WI haha, yea i could meet up with ya sometime this weekend and see whats up with your galant. Welcome to the site btw.

[Galant306m]

yeah you do need a vavle spring compressor... the water isn't that bad of an idea... i would deff do that... then you only have to remove your known bad ones..

valve spring compressors are for pussies real men use a hammer and a socket.

[mrg7243]

valve spring compressors are for pussies real men use a hammer and a socket.

X2, just dont lose the retainers, they are so damn tiny they are easy to lose

[dGALANTc]

Oh shits lol did not see that you where from WI haha, yea i could meet up with ya sometime this weekend and see whats up with your galant. Welcome to the site btw.

im from st louis just moved this way about a month and a half ago, im in sussex.

hammer and socket huh i can only guess...lol
sounds good ill def like another eye on it for sure.

[Stewi]

You can probably pickup a good used SOHC head from someone on here for about $50+shipping, then you dont have to worry about any of the valves, rockers, retainers etc. Just clean the mating surfaces, replace the headgasket and bolts and your done.

[reiketsutsukigami]

i already offered him that route stewi waiting to see if there any actual valve dmg first though.

[Galant306m]

You can probably pickup a good used SOHC head from someone on here for about $50+shipping, then you dont have to worry about any of the valves, rockers, retainers etc. Just clean the mating surfaces, replace the headgasket and bolts and your done.

True, but rebuilding heads is so much more fun the just swapping one :bouncing:

[dGALANTc]

You can probably pickup a good used SOHC head from someone on here for about $50+shipping, then you dont have to worry about any of the valves, rockers, retainers etc. Just clean the mating surfaces, replace the headgasket and bolts and your done.

yea reik offered me a head and i wasnt sure but i just got a job soooooo im still not sure lol. depends on how this transmission replacement goes on my gf car next week. if that goes well we will have a dd and im going DOHC!!!!! ill let you know reik...


True, but rebuilding heads is so much more fun the just swapping one :bouncing:

yea more fun, i think. lol. but i almost got the head off today but the damn garage im working in has no freaking lights so it got too dark too fast.

[dGALANTc]

im sure i did things ass backward now but i seem to be stuck on two bolts camshaft sprocket, and the crankshaft pulley and i have either not the right tools or not the right manpower lol. i have read all the threads on removing the crankshaft bolt but my timing belt was off already and everything is torn apart so i cant crank it over... impact im guessing??? and the darn camshaft i just cant get enough torque on the thing to break it. anything guys???

[reiketsutsukigami]

...i used an electric impact on my crank bolt got it off just fine but i nvr took the cam off but uhm dont mind me asking but why are you removing those? you should be able to slide the new belt right over with a bit of pulling

[dGALANTc]

the crankshaft pulley has to be removed to get the lower timing cover off. unless im missing something. and
Best way to see if you have bad valves, take the head off and remove the cam.... a few posts up is why i planned on removing the cam think im doing something wrong?

[Shadow19]

ok another way to check for a bent valve is to remove the head and cams put a light under each valve and look down in the port. If you see light around the seats its bent or worn out. Or if you have them out stick them in a drill and see if they wobble...... Just dont tighten them too much in the drill and gouge the valve. Another way to do it is to set them on a flat surface and if they are not perfectly plumb (straight up and down) they are bent, Its REALLY obvious. And yes you do have to remove the harmonic balancer in order to get the lower timing cover off.

[reiketsutsukigami]

oh well then ya remove the cam gear, but with the bottom pulley you only have to take off the 4 12mm bolt not the middle one those 4 should be easy to remove with some moderate force the one in the middle is the crank sprocket it doesnt need to be removed.

[Galant306m]

the crankshaft pulley has to be removed to get the lower timing cover off. unless im missing something. and a few posts up is why i planned on removing the cam think im doing something wrong?

yea pull the head off first then pull the cam out, put the head on a bench then fill it with water.

[dGALANTc]

ok another way to check for a bent valve is to remove the head and cams put a light under each valve and look down in the port. If you see light around the seats its bent or worn out. Or if you have them out stick them in a drill and see if they wobble...... Just dont tighten them too much in the drill and gouge the valve. Another way to do it is to set them on a flat surface and if they are not perfectly plumb (straight up and down) they are bent, Its REALLY obvious. And yes you do have to remove the harmonic balancer in order to get the lower timing cover off.

thanks for the tips appreciated man


oh well then ya remove the cam gear, but with the bottom pulley you only have to take off the 4 12mm bolt not the middle one those 4 should be easy to remove with some moderate force the one in the middle is the crank sprocket it doesnt need to be removed.

no shyt really? the big ass 22mm nut or whatever with the 1/2in drive ratchet slot in the middle doesnt need to be removed just the 4 smaller ones around it?


yea pull the head off first then pull the cam out, put the head on a bench then fill it with water.

ok ill do just that and wont worry about the cam sprocket any longer

holy shit why am i still up its 4am

[dGALANTc]

oh well then ya remove the cam gear, but with the bottom pulley you only have to take off the 4 12mm bolt not the middle one those 4 should be easy to remove with some moderate force the one in the middle is the crank sprocket it doesnt need to be removed.

man thanks for that bit of info!!!!!!!!!!!!! helped me out 100% considering that the head is now off! finally huh. ill still let you know about the head sometime next week sorry for holding it off longer.


yea pull the head off first then pull the cam out, put the head on a bench then fill it with water.

ok so its off i put it on a bench and fill it with water and look to see if its leaking, and where right?

on another note the damn pistons have soooooo much carbon build up on them its crazy idk what i should do about that!!! look

http://i867.photobucket.com/albums/ab236/dgcimme/headoff023.jpg
http://i867.photobucket.com/albums/ab236/dgcimme/headoff024.jpg

all of them are pretty bad and i havent really even gotten to looking at the head any further.... thanks again guys be prepared for more questions soon lol

[Shadow19]

spray some brake parts cleaner on a rag and go at it. If i were you i wouldnt put water in the head and if you do remember to lube anything the water came into contact with. The light method will tell you if they leak or not. Remember water is thicker than air so......... you get the hint. Those look pretty bad, it actually looks as if you had a head gasket leak for quite some time judging by the crap the coolant burned off of the top of the pistons and the spots where it looks kinda clean. Make sure your head is not warped and DO NOT get a dumb idea with a wire wheel to the pistons to get the carbon off. I would say just saturate them with brake parts cleaner but youd have to soak it up immediately so just do the rag method, it doesnt have to be completely spotless just get the big chunks of crap out of there. Post up if you have any issues. Im not a 8g guy but its all pretty much the same.

[dGALANTc]

thanks for the advice^^^does the cam have to be out to test it its free spinning now and is making no contact with anything... just curious

[reiketsutsukigami]

damn that pic makes me glad i was running lean b4 i took my head off my pistons were spotless XD.

[Shadow19]

thanks for the advice^^^does the cam have to be out to test it its free spinning now and is making no contact with anything... just curious

How is it free spinning and making no contact with anything? Thats odd... the cam lobes should rotate and push on the rocker arms which push down the valve springs. Are you able to turn it with your hand? And you dont HAVE to take the cam off, you could rotate it to where all valves are closed but its best to take it off. Youll need to replace the valve stem seals anyways while youre already there. If not youll be fighting a big huge pain in the ass to replace them while in the car. Its not hard to remove the cam. 10 or 12 bolts. Just remember which cap goes where and note the direction they were facing then the torque on them should be like 23 ft lbs or something like that. Also the rocker arm shaft has two holes at the bottom, make sure you put them down so your lash adjusters will get oil. If not your first start up will be LOUUUUUUUD as hell.

[dGALANTc]

the rockers are out already but the cam sprocket is still attached to the cam. Thanks for the tips as well

[Shadow19]

The cam sprocket doesnt have to be removed atleast in the 7g it doesnt.

[dGALANTc]

so i did the water trick that was suggested and there was no leak from the valves so im guessing there is no leak because if its water tight it must be air tight right. tried the light thing too and i saw no light so im guessing the valves arent bent. if anyone could chime in i would really appreciate it.

[Galantman03]

there was no leak from the valves so im guessing there is no leak because if its water tight it must be air tight right?

NOPE.... water has bigger molecules than air.... so what might be water "proof" or water tight doesn't mean its air tight... example? gortex... water proof, but able to "breathe" or lets air circulate.. HOW? air has smaller molecules compared to water and is allowed to escape or breath but water isn't. another example? lol a condom...

[dGALANTc]

NOPE.... water has bigger molecules than air.... so what might be water "proof" or water tight doesn't mean its air tight... example? gortex... water proof, but able to "breathe" or lets air circulate.. HOW? air has smaller molecules compared to water and is allowed to escape or breath but water isn't. another example? lol a condom...

understood but i also shined a light in the head while it was dark and saw no light shining through. i figured two tests were better than one.

[Shadow19]

You should be fine then. Now replace the valve stem seals and you should be good to go. Remember when you remove valves they must go back in the port they cam out of or youll be cutting the seats and making them match.

[dGALANTc]

gotcha thanks for the help shadow and the other guys. appreciated greatly.