Stall convertor vs. 5 speed swap

**Xrs2** · 10-22-2005, 11:01 PM

A little background about my car.

I have a Galant GTZ 02 8G with 17's.

Eibachs and exhaust sitting in my garage collecting dust. I am going to install them over the winter. Anyway, I was thinking about going for either a Stall convertor and Auto tranny cooler or a 5 speed swap.

To me it seems like traction is a problem with the galant 5 speeds, and any kinda power.

I wouldnt say I'm cheap, but I cant see spending 1000 more dollars for something that is just gonna spin my tires. I could get an insert/LSD, but i can do that for each tranny, so that kinda cancels itself out.

Everyone says that you get more power to the ground with a manual, but from what i read if you get a higher stall torque convertor, you can be just as fast as a MT.

I am on the fence what to do here, the MT swap seems like alot of work + money. When in the end if i can go just as fast with a AT than i will do that.

I have a Eagle Talon TSI 92. Its 5 speed and I loved to drive it. There is no better feeling than a turbo kicking in. It has seen better days tho. motor needs to be re-rung...anyway haha.

1. 5-speed swap 1500.00 aboutish
2. HST convertor 410.00 + whatever a tranny cooler costs (50.00ish i think)

Future plans for the car are cams, apex and then a jet chip and im done. Im not looking for a racecar here, just something with some decent power. I have a feeling that 1 million people are gonna say do the tranny swap but be practical here. Is it really worth all that work and money.

I am really on the fence here. Not sure whhhhattt to do. 5 speed swapers I want to here if it was worth it, and if you could do it again would you. I dont think anyone is running a HSTall TC on a galant, so if I get one I'll get her dynoed for ya'll.

I'll get some pic of my cars up then. So you guys can see what im working with here.

I cant make decisions myself. I have read every single post I can find on the 5speed swap, and the High stall torque convertor. I have spoken with relzo, and he seems to know his shit.

Tell me something I dont know, pleasse.

theblackpearl · 10-23-2005, 12:55 AM

if you know how to drive you wont burn out all the time...and having an extra gear can go a long ways.. do the swap!

**hsinya** · 10-23-2005, 01:36 AM

traction is only a problem if you have a lead foot. people gotta learn how to control the throttle.

deciding between the 2 really depends on what you want to do with the car. if you're gonna drag race / drive in a straight line i'd say go with the torque converter.

if you're planing to autox / canyon runs / or anything that involves turning go with the manual as it give you more control.

being someone that has done the 5speed swap to my car i would definately say its worth it only because i have done more drivetrain mods. (lightweight stage 1 clutch and a lightweight flywheel) and i also prefer carving corners over taking off in a straight line so you can get an idea of where i'm coming from.

correct me if i'm wrong but i don't think there are any cams for our motors, or are you gonna get one custom made? also wut do u mean by apex?

**qnz** · 10-23-2005, 03:40 AM

rpw makes cams for eclipse (our) motors.

**peanotation** · 10-23-2005, 01:04 PM

the big difference is you get another gear with the manual, thus your faster already since you can burn through the gears faster. better overall gear ratio...

i've sat in cars with fully built automatics and high stall TCs, and i have to say i couldn't disagree with them more. i still prefer a manual. way more control. you can learn to shift almost as fast with the manual, and you're going to burn out with both no matter what. you can feather the clutch in a manual transmission though.

why doesn't john shepherd have a fully built automatic in his 8-second gsx? because he's not an idiot, and there's a reason why he holds the fastest quarter mile time on a street car

**Stewi** · 10-23-2005, 01:20 PM

Originally Posted by peanotation

the big difference is you get another gear with the manual, thus your faster already since you can burn through the gears faster. better overall gear ratio...

i've sat in cars with fully built automatics and high stall TCs, and i have to say i couldn't disagree with them more. i still prefer a manual. way more control. you can learn to shift almost as fast with the manual, and you're going to burn out with both no matter what. you can feather the clutch in a manual transmission though.

why doesn't john shepherd have a fully built automatic in his 8-second gsx? because he's not an idiot, and there's a reason why he holds the fastest quarter mile time on a street car

Uhh oohhhh Peano, you are mitaken my friend. Now Shepherd has a 7 second GSX, 5 speed of course. I swear if shep makes that car go any faster its gonna fly away

**peanotation** · 10-23-2005, 01:22 PM

well i figured 7.97 = 8 8)

**thebirdman13** · 10-23-2005, 01:58 PM

Originally Posted by qnz

rpw makes cams for eclipse (our) motors.

they make camshafts and gears for the 6G72 SOHC, yes, but the shaft is $1000 and the gear is $125... plus shipping from australia... they make alot of useful engine parts, just have to wait a LONG time to get them...

i was also wondering what Apex is...??

**Jet Black** · 10-23-2005, 02:07 PM

Well instead of getting either, why dont you go turbo?

theblackpearl · 10-23-2005, 02:37 PM

Originally Posted by Jet Black

Well instead of getting either, why dont you go turbo?

why dont you get a 5spd ...then go turbo..

**Jet Black** · 10-23-2005, 03:27 PM

Originally Posted by theblackpearl

Originally Posted by Jet Black

Well instead of getting either, why dont you go turbo?

why dont you get a 5spd ...then go turbo..

Cause I just happened to run across some turbo manifolds. Seriously I was dead set on the 5spd till I found out that someone was selling there manifolds.

Couldn't help myself.

**Xrs2** · 10-23-2005, 05:26 PM

apexi s-afc II

don't know why I abbreviated it that way. I was a little tired so I'll blame it on that. however i prolly am just stupid and lost my train of though half way through the name...

I agree that manuals are alot funner to drive, but are they 1000 dollars fun? haveing an auto isnt the worst thing to ever happen to me is it?

Why not go turbo, because screw peiceing together a system myself. I dont' have the money or the patience to peice togther a custom system. mostly patience is the problem on that one. Too much work. Why not go RIPP SC. Because that much HP on a FW drive car is def. going to break something sooner or later, probably sooner. Plus I dont want to drop 5 grand on a car I got for 10.

I wouldn't say my car is slow right now. So anything added is just icing on the cake.

**Jet Black** · 10-23-2005, 07:58 PM

Originally Posted by Xrs2

I wouldn't say my car is slow right now. So anything added is just icing on the cake.

Wow I never thought I would hear a DSM guy say that. :shock: You in exile from the DSM boards?

**Xrs2** · 10-23-2005, 08:06 PM

haha

If i had the money i would be riding in a rocket ship. but i dont have that much money to blow. so it is gonna have to be fast enough for me.

**Stewi** · 10-23-2005, 08:18 PM

Originally Posted by Xrs2

apexi s-afc II

don't know why I abbreviated it that way. I was a little tired so I'll blame it on that. however i prolly am just stupid and lost my train of though half way through the name...

I agree that manuals are alot funner to drive, but are they 1000 dollars fun? haveing an auto isnt the worst thing to ever happen to me is it?

Why not go turbo, because screw peiceing together a system myself. I dont' have the money or the patience to peice togther a custom system. mostly patience is the problem on that one. Too much work. Why not go RIPP SC. Because that much HP on a FW drive car is def. going to break something sooner or later, probably sooner. Plus I dont want to drop 5 grand on a car I got for 10.

I wouldn't say my car is slow right now. So anything added is just icing on the cake.

Just an FYI, I was making 370whp on my FWD 5 speed, all it has is a Quaife LSD. There are also a few guys on Club3g, with V6 Eclipse's making over 400whp with just an LSD as far as trany mods.

To answer your question about 5 speed vs hi stall converter. If your not willing to spend the money to buy go-fast parts like a turbo kit or SC kit or whatever. I saw your gonna get cams, SAFC, and a jet chip. Getting an SAFC and Jet chip is kinda taking 1 step forward and 2 steps back, your gonna have the chip remapped for performance then have the S-AFC make adjustest to the Chip settings that you just had made? That doesnt seem to make much sense. Cams arent going to make a ton of power more on your car, not to the point you need a high stall torque converter. The 5 speed will at least make the car accelerate faster due to better gearing. I did a 5 speed swap on a 2001 ES 4 cylinder with a RIPP kit runing 10psi, just driving his car after the 5 speed swap it was like night and day. If you plan to just get cams, a chip, maybe intake and exhaust. Your best bet is to just get a tranny cooler and thats it. The torque converter really isnt going to due that much. There are guys on club3g with turbo kits on Auto's with just tranny coolers and they are holding up fine. Its like your spending the money in the wrong places. Rather then spending $1000 on cams and $400 on a converter, maybe just spend $1500-$2000 and pick up a used supercharger kit from someone. I see Stage 1 kits on club3g sell for under $2,000 all the time. Get the tranny cooler, its probably the easier mod you can do, its like $60 and you can do it in 45 mins. Heat kills AT trannies, tranny coolers kill heat. Get one.

**DOHCstunr** · 10-23-2005, 09:09 PM

another factor is when you go with a built auto tranny and high stall lockup torqe converters drivbilty on the street changes..

it doens't matter how built your manual tranny is. you can put all the strongest gears, triple cone synchros, differentials, and even the strongest clutches and lightest flywheels.
and after all that. every single shift can be as smooth as you want it to be. if you have an unsprung 3 puck clutch and a 3500 lb pressure plate, yes it takes a bit of effort and a little slippage to get it tino first and reverse, but after that
every gear can be rev matched and engaged like butter. and with a little practice, you can take your supercar ou on the town with your girlfriend with no harsh reminders o fthe sacrifices you made for power.

with a built auto, shifts only get harder. even when you are driving with a soft foot. in fact from my expierience with them, a built automatic only feels like it should when you are OWNing the road.
plus built automatics are expensive, heavy and hot.
who needs that...