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Reply With QuoteFucking beautiful :shock:
I wasn't even aware you actually installed it and everything. Man that is impressive. So do you have any plans for some FI?
damn those wires make me dizzy..
Fucking beautiful :shock:
I wasn't even aware you actually installed it and everything. Man that is impressive. So do you have any plans for some FI?
hell yeah. what i plan to do though is to save up enough money to have the 3.5 machined .020 for a set of forged cp's and will have the rest of the rotating assembly cryotreated and arp studded. the heads will get a major flow job done and to top it all off i will use the xg350 intake manifold as a template for my sheetmetal intake which will recieve a Q45's throttle body (90mm). i still havent decided on whether i am going to make tubular manifolds or go with more of a log setup. the log would be stronger but the tubular will be gorgeous and will flow better. man this 3.5 is either really that fast or i am suffering from the biggest pleceibo effect i have ever feltnumbers will come in two days. promised.
lol i guess being an electrician on F-16's for the last six years has gotten me used to seeing shit like that. its funny because i saw the harness and was like oh thats it? there are worse things on the 16 by far.Originally Posted by milo111000
oh lookie lookie what i just got. the ups guys knows my nickname because he sees me some much. lol. looks like another busy weekend.
damn boy... you bagged alot o cash on this project.. happy for yah bro..
yeah i know. tell me about it, my pockets are starting to steam a little. but ramon noodles are so good anyway that being broke for the rest of the month is alright
hehehehe i've been on the cup o noodle diet too!!!!!
damn springs 2! Your ride is going to look good and perform well also!
nice man!
Dear mother of god that is fucking awesome! I had no idea you were a fabricator as well! As it stands I'm at a total loss for words. You've just encompessed my distant dream...
Especially the part about redoing both manifolds . My biggest qualm about all the V6 turbo kits out there is the fact that a) the collector pipe design is absolute trash, b) and the compressor side of things is no better.
Let me explain my vision and see what you think.
Collector Pipes
As I mentioned above, the current design that is being used for these pipes is for the most part inefficient. The rear bank's collector is about 4-5 times larger than the front banks. Without a doubt this introduces all types of inefficiencies into the overall system (ranging from pumping losses, to poor airflow dynamics). In my opinion the a much better setup is this one (scroll down). Idealy it would be great if you could have all six individual runners collect immediately before the turbine inlet. Either way the first step in refining this design would be to allow for equal length collectors on both banks. Similiar to the 3000GT setup, the turbo would be mounted above the transmission. This way you wouldn't be applying unequal loads to the banks. Just to reiterate, individual runners would be fucking SWEET!
Intake Manifold
Yet another design flaw. Due to the orientation of our plenums, and the location of the turbo, the incoming air is forced to do U-turn to reach the throttle body. Instead if you reversed the orientation of the plenum (with the TB facing the belts) you would be able to run a much simpler and shorter setup (i.e. a "loop" setup). For the plenum construction itself, I would consider doing some research into it (if you havn't already). With a little math, you could have a killer intake setup that greatly compliments your overall system. A google search for Intake Manifold Design will yield a rediclous amount of information on the subject. And btw good call on the 90mm TB.
Anyways I've spent WAY to long on this post. Its about time I wrap it up. I'll leave you with a link for the materials required: Racing Solutions. Not only do they sell mandrel bent tubing kits at a great price, but they also carry exhaust manifold flanges for the V6.
Good luck dude, and definetly keep us updated.
man its so funny that you found racing solutions. i thought that shit was a little secret when i found it and the best kept kind because they have really good deals on the prebent sections and bundles. i was going to go high class and get all my steel from burns stainless but then i saw the cost and it really turned me off to it all. i was really lucky to find racing solutions.
now as far as the manifolds go, the stock manifolds have been known to handle the supposed 1200 cfm each that a boosted 72 would make but then again they most likely raise the egt's too high for some reliable power in the long run. so definately bring yourself to get or make manifolds whether they are going to go down like the tearstone kit or go over like the single turbo vr4's do. i really favor the setup that has been done for years by the vr4 guys. there is less hot side piping which would allow for quicker spool up and give you the opportunity to fab up some nice looking heat sheilds or show off some coating you may throw on the pipes. one thing is for sure though is that if you do go tubular then you must find a way to brace them so that they dont have the entire load of not only the turbo but the exhaust as well. check out gto nemesis' vr4 on google or 3si.org and see how he did his piping for the manifolds and i think you wiil love his design.
on to the intake mani. the stock mani you must get rid of. point blank. it does nothing for the gathering, separating, and production of nonturbulent air for the runners for this motor. the diamante mani is very well suited for making power in an NA application or even better for FI provided it has a much better design and proves to be much more efficient. i have been researching the whole reason to make an intake manifold and here is what i have concluded. if you have the availibility for more air then what better way to do it than with an intake manifold that can flow much more than stock. but remember the bottle neck to every manifold design is the throttle body. if you have this gigantic mani and the stock tb, then it will take you longer to fill the surge tank which would result in poor driveability and drop the efficiency of the mani. but whenever you make a mani be sure to have it flowbenched as you do not want to have uneven flow between the cylinders. ok ok ill stop with my 101 on intakes but im just adament about knowing whats going on with making power and the key is research.
i want to do something like this but without the elbow. it will have the q45 tb on it and i bet you i could make about 20whp tuned with it. this is my next project
Ya dude Racing Solutions is unbelievable. I havn't found a single site out there that can compete with their prices...on the other end of the spectrum is Burns. Since I'm not a cocaine distrubitor I didn't even consider sourcing from them. Though I do enjoy browsing their catalogue (window shopping).
***Before you start reading this, please understand at times I maybe a little redundant, but its only because I was spilling out my thoughts. In others words I wasn't trying to talk down to you.***
But ya I'm most definetly going to be following the steps of the VR4 guys for my next setup. Besides looking dead sexy, I figure the airflow dynamics of their setup is considerably more effecient than the xTech/Tearstone pipes that we use. Personally I believe that part of the reason (amongst others) that these motors don't handle much boost in the double digits range lies with the overall manifold design. A manifold with individual runners (up to the turbine inlet) could potentially allow for higher boost levels on the stock motor. My prediction is that by isolating every cylinder's exhaust stream, you significantly decrease exhaust back pressure at a very crucial point, i.e. the cylinder head. I believe the back pressure creates multiple sources of ineffeciency such as parasitic pumping losses (some of the piston's energy is expended in order to overcome the back pressure), to increased EGTs (Gas Laws). The back pressure is caused by the sudden drop in exhaust gas velocity due to interaction with the turbine blades. This is one of the fundemental operating principles of a turbocharger; a "trail" of back pressure exists before the inlet in order get the turbine rotating. With the current collector pipes being designed as they are, I believe the "pressure trail" streches to close to the front bank due to the short length of piping between the turbine inlet and the cylinder head. This could be yet another reason why the front bank is more prone to catastrophe, as it naturally experiences a considerable amount of the back pressure.
With the individual-runner/VR4 setup, the back pressure is moved considerably further away from the cylinder head, the individual exhaust streams no longer interfere with one and another, and it evens out the pressure distribution. I see it as somewhat analogous to the whole NA header system. I believe they use some of the same fundemental principles as I mentioned. The runners/extractors basically allow each cylinder to function with much greater effeciency than normal. Anyways to simplify my thoughts, the ideal manifold (IMO) is one with seperate runners up to the inlet flange. While I would prefer equal length runners, it's really not a big concern to me, so much as the individual runners.
Now bracing more than likely will be required. I imagine some sort of system of brackets welded between the individual runners would help...brace....the manifolds. Idealy in the end, the manifold/turbo setup would be braced to the engine itself as to allow it to move with it (e.g. sudden changes in throttle position).
As for the intake manifold, I think we both despise the stock one equally. Even in its NA forms its trash, let alone FI. I will always wonder why Mitsubishi decided to de-evolve this paticular design from the original. The Diamante manifold looks great, and without a doubt is leaps ahead of our stock one. Though from the minimal reading I've done so far regarding manifold design, I wonder if it's really all that well suited for our application. Considering that low end torque isn't an issue for either of us (much less you), I think in general a "large" turbo would be best suited for us, i.e. something that could move a considerable amount of air at the higher RPMs. With that being the case, a plenum design that would compliment this would be something with a) surge tank with a volume equal to overall displacement, b) short runners, and c) greater cross sectional area for each runner. The Diamante plenum is the exact opposite of this. It has long skinny runners with a relatively tiny surge tank. It works great in its paticular application because the whole system was built for low end torque in the NA form. In that sense I think the whole design could be refined to better suit our applications. Also for sure a large throttle body is a must. I didn't even think about that till you brought it up last night. I'm really intrested to see how you are going to go about making it work. I can't even imagine where to start in that regards. From the TPS, to the intricate vacuum passages that remind me of the tunnels in the Great Pyramids. In other words, I may have to steel your TB setup.
That is what I'm fucking talking about! That is exactly what I'm talking about. But as you pointed out, no need for the elbow (kinda strange really), and a mother-of-all throttle bodys on the other end of it.i want to do something like this but without the elbow. it will have the q45 tb on it and i bet you i could make about 20whp tuned with it. this is my next project
Either way, anything I fab up will be half as shiny, and use some cheap ass mild 304 steel. No need for this fancy 321 or anything like that. Shit if the xTech kits got away using fence post (aluminumized 304 ~ probably with terrible metal composition, considering their originally intended use), then a simple plenum can use damn near anything. :D
well just from a general assestment you seem to know exactly what you are talking about. very good on you for doing the much needed research it takes to dig into the facets of this car with one's creativity and make it perform. it seems to make any kind of real hp out of this design (without getting into re-engineering) you have to get creative. i like your approach also. the vr4 guys have an infinate amount of knowledge when it comes to the 6g series motors and its sisters. this platform has so much potential that people overlook that it becomes overlooked in being modded. and with money well spent one can have a car that can be considered a triple threat.
ok people as promised. i just got off the rollers and put down some really good numbers for this 5000ft altitude and no tune. final numbers were 186.6whp and 198.0wtrq! peak torque was 218.1! like i said this is at a crazy ass utah mountain altitude and no tune. the no tune part is signifcant in the fact that i kept the diamante 270cc injectors in. so the ecu doesnt recognize this since there has been no injector scaling done and runs them like they were the 210's it came with. my afr is rich, very rich so rich that my afr's got down to 10.61. for a NA car that is only good when you have a lot of compression and a lot of air digestion. so in conclusion i would have to say since the car only weighs 3040lbs and has a very minimal drivetrain loss... its a damn quick galant!
here is what i was making before
here is what i put down today
like i said not only does this dyno read low (read a 400hp gto at 280whp) but the altitude was also a factor.
Unfortunately, my tranny got chipped, and I'm looking for someone who can weld it for me:
https://thegalantcenter.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=54464
I don't remember what the pins were on the eManage as it was a while ago when I wired it up, but I used these as reference:
http://mitsuoafl.com/board/showthread.php?t=5058
http://www.club3g.com/forum/showthread.php?t=47869
That is pretty impressive considering all the factors you mentioned. BTW How did you drop your curb weight by so much?
Removed the driver.
j/k. haha
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