Balancing shaft Kit... ( Removal ) Help Please ;)

[Eclipse97526]

My good old galant is going on 8 years old ! and she is starting to shake when i hold my foot on the break and come to a stop, while the car is in drive. i have heard that this is the balancing shafts going out... And they will basicly start to eat your engine up after they start going out. A friend of mine has a 1g talon, and said he knows how to do the kit, i just have to get one... I didnt wanna just buy a kit for a 4g63. and have it be for a 6bolt or a 7 bolt, i dont know which motor i have, or which 4g63 parts are compatable with the 4g64. If someone could help me out in finding a site where i can purchase this 4g64 balance elemination kit. For my 1999 Galant USDM 2.4 L ES ! Thanks for any help !

[Stewi]

I dont really know if the balance shaft is your problem but you seem pretty animate that it is. With that being said, the one for a 2g eclipse is exactly the same as ours. FYI, if you want to save some cash, you dont really need the whole kit. the kit includes a plug to plug the upper shaft hole, two rings to block off the spot where the bearings used to be and a stub shaft for the oil pump. The rings are gay, most people just take the old balance bearings out and flip them upside down. The purpose of the ring is to stop the oil from coming out of the block where it used to spray into the balance shaft bearings. When you flip the bearings over, it blocks the oil passage, doing the same thing the ring did. Next is the plug, its pretty much a standard freeze plug that any machine shop can get. then the stub shaft, the stub shaft is actually a Mitsu OEM part. You can get it right from the dealer, I think its like $6. If you go to a machine shop, they can get you the plug, its like $1 then $6 for the stub shaft. There is your $7 balance shaft eliminator kit. If shopping around for this stuff is too much work, you can buy the Kit from Buschur Racing, Magnus motorsports, Slowboy Racing, AMS, RoadRace Engineering, etc. I think the kit is about $30.

[seth98esT]

The balance shafts dont go out, the belt can break though. For all you know a bad motor mount could be causing the problem. Id look a little further into the situation before you come to a conclusion.

[Eclipse97526]

Well Also i hear that thoes balancing shafts are heavy, and it frees up alot of power ;) But what else could the problem be ?

[lonestar22]

im more sure its your motor mounts than your balance shafts

[GOOSEY2099]

Don't guess, If you don't know what you'r doing or talking about just take it to a shop..

[qnz]

isnt it hard to remove the balance shaft with the motor still in? I always hear that its not for the feint of heart

[Eclipse97526]

yes. The motor must be removed. But they are 2 shafts that are about 6 inches long and weight about 5 lbs each, and yea.... a friend of mine has done it a few times, and said he would do it for me if i bought the kit.... So should i do this ? ( balancing kit removal ) or just shine it for now ? i heard it makes your engine more responsive. And thanks, i will look at my motor mounts. check them all out, and find out if that is the problem or not. But its only when im in drive with the break on, everything shakes, fairly bad..
and i agree with you there, on knowing something is wrong before you fix it.. Also... My Wheel is making a grinding noise.... And its not the breaks or rotors... Would this be the wheel bearing ?

[seth98esT]

I removed my balanceshafts while the engine was still in the car. You dont have to remove the rear balanceshaft that attaches to the balanceshaft sprocket, just remove the belt. Then remove the front balanceshaft thats attached to the oilpump sprocket and replace it with the stubby.

The rear balanceshaft is a pita to remove if the motor is still int he car, I had to pull mine out halfway, cut it in half with a dremell, then remove the other half!

I wouldnt recommend deleting the balanceshafts just to delete them, its not worth it. If you need to change the timing belt and water pump and already have everything apart then sure, delete the balanceshafts. But dont remove the entire engine just to delete them, you wont notice a big gain in power at all, it is minimal, plus you get extra vibrations without the balanceshafts which Im sure the auto makes 10x worse.

Only thing that can go wrong with the balanceshafts is that the belt can break or you can throw a balanceshaft bearing. But only a broken belt will cause the vibration. My money is on a bad mount, if it was a snapped bs belt, the vibration would be there in any gear at any rpm.

[underated]

don't they recommend removing the balance shafts during a rebuild because you need to balance the rotating assembly so you don't feel the extra vibration?

i bought the kit from slowboy but i wish i would have known the info Stewi posted lol

[Stewi]

You dont need to remove them but most people do. If the balance shafts werent so prone to having the bearings or belt fail then we wouldnt need to remove them. The problem is the bearings spin, the belt breaks and falls onto the timing belt and takes out the whole damn motor. So its easier to spend the $30 on the kit and have the piece of mind that your motor isnt going to break because of a stupid ass balance shaft problem.

[Eclipse97526]

Yea. Well im lookin for a 5spd tranny out of a 2001 Eclipse GS :) I think that is what i need. And then im going to Eliminate my balancing shafts. and my ride is gettin a few miles on her, almost time to do the timing belt and water pump, etc. Even thought its really clean... and i take great care of her.

[seth98esT]

If its still on the original timing belts, its about 48,000 miles overdue ;)

[Shadow19]

From experience. I think the kit is worth it. If i had to guess.. The balance shafts weigh atleast 15-20 lbs... I personally dont see deleting just 1 balance shaft.. U will still have the other one hooked to the oil pump and the crank spins the pump.. So thats weight that could be taken off of the crank and added HP. If you delete the shafts. Jerk the motor out and rebuild the fucker. Its CHEAP as fuck to rebuild our motors as long as u dont have to get the block bored out and buy a crankshaft. Oh yea.. The bearings are a pain in the ass. The key to getting the rear bearing out and putting it back in is to flip the balance shaft around and insert it backwards and beat the bearing out.. (i dont know why the front of the shaft is bigger than the back but trust me on this).

I did this mod when i swapped trannys.. So i dont know the vibration on a auto that has had the balance shafts removed. To be honest.. With my auto tranny and BRAND new mounts.. The car vibrated more then than it does now with the 5 speed and no balance shafts.

[seth98esT]

On 8g motors, their pulleys are flipped. So their rear balanceshaft is attached to their oil pump no? You dont have to remove both balance shafts, just the one attached to the oil pump and replace it with the stubby. I weighed my extras and it came to 8lbs for both. If you just leave the front balanceshaft in(the one attached to the balanceshaft gear) you can just disconnect the belt and leave it be, it would just be dead weight, like 4 lbs of dead weight. You arent gaining anything by removing it, just losing 3lbs out of the front end.

[Stewi]

Seth out motors are the same but flipped 180 degrees. Our front (lower) balance shaft is attached to the oil pump and the rear (upper) shaft is on the pulley. Your thinking of it as a mirror image, rather than being rotated.

[seth98esT]

Weird, Ive never looked at the pulley system on an 8g. :P

[Eclipse97526]

Well it may only be 4 lbs u are leaving into the motor, but it is conected internaly, and therefor taking power to operate. loosing more HP than you think, i gotta find a 2001 eclipse gs 5sp tranny ! and then ill pull the motor and eleminate bolth balancing shafts, and throw on the 5 speed. Run my linkage, good to go ! Do you gotta do anything with the stock ECU When u swap up to a 5 speed ?

[underated]

ok i did some reading on the subject it think it was from dsmtuners but there was a suggestion to remove the belt and the upper shaft (not connected to oil pump)... then for the shaft that is connected to the oil pump throw it on the lathe and shave the counter weight off...

the reason being is that the vibration from the shaft being gone messes with the oil pump causing it to prematurely wear

is that true?

[seth98esT]

Well it may only be 4 lbs u are leaving into the motor, but it is conected internaly, and therefor taking power to operate. loosing more HP than you think, i gotta find a 2001 eclipse gs 5sp tranny ! and then ill pull the motor and eleminate bolth balancing shafts, and throw on the 5 speed. Run my linkage, good to go ! Do you gotta do anything with the stock ECU When u swap up to a 5 speed ?

Incorrect. If you take the bs belt off the rear shaft, the shaft is just dead weight, you are not gaining any power at all by removing the rear balance shaft as long as the bs belt is disconnected.

Now for the front shaft, it is driven by the oil pump, which is driven by the timing belt. For that one, you have to remove the shaft and either cut it or just use the OEM stubby shaft in its place.

And Ive heard that removing the balance shafts does cause premature wear on the oil pump, but I think that is only the case if you only remove one balance shaft or if you dont replace the oil pump balance shaft with an oem stubby shaft. Theres an aftermarket stubby shaft out there that does not have one of the oiling galleys that helps oil the oilpump gears, and that might be a reason for premature wear.

I know if mannybrews pops in, he will tell you that removing balanceshafts in any manner is pointless and should not be done. Only reason I did it was to delete the balanceshaft belt, one less worry for me.