Failed emissions, 3 Codes, Nothing fixes it. Long write up

[CHICAGO_ONE]

Ok, so this may get a little winded but here's my dilema. 2003 ES 4 cyl. Bought the car off craigslist.

With no Check Engine light on and the car is driving fine, I take it to get my emissions test done. The guy tells me that the car failed and popped 3 codes (WTF):
P0421 (warm up catalyst), P0335 (crankshaft position sensor), P0340 (camshaft position sensor)

So, I'm curious to find out why the Check Engine light didnt come on. Randomly, I pull out the gauge cluster and BAM, the bulb had been removed. F me right?

I put in a bulb and sure enough it lights up. Take the car to autozone and get the codes read again just to triple check for my reference, same 3 pop up.

Moment of truth: I'm not that mechanically inclined. Simple adjustments, modifications, oil changes, etc. I'm comfortable with, but lack of space, knowledge, tools is holding me back at the moment. SO...
I go to my trusted mechanic and tell him the issue. He says before we dive into anything, lets clear the codes and see what happens. Maybe some of those codes were stored/memory? If the light pops up, check the codes right away. Sure enough, less than 200 feet from the shop, the light pops up. This time its only P0335/P0340

At this point, I don't have the time to leave it at the shop and decided to hang onto it for a few more days. Get the codes checked again after a few days and now its all 3 again: P0421/ P0335 / P0340 Keep in mind, the car drives fine and has no issues other than this light. BUT I need to pass emissions by May 31st

I decide to bite the bullet and let him fix the cam/crank sensors and see whatsup with the cat/02 issue. He goes and puts in the cam/crank sensor and calls to tell me there's a problem. The Check Engine light popped back on with the same codes. Seemingly, this has nothing to do with the sensors.

Now after looking through the car, spending 10+ hours on it, he's under the impression this engine is the wrong year for the car and that the computer was never changed. He thinks that IF we changed the computer to match the year of the engine, it would fix this issue. Problem is we don't know what year this engine is from and cannot identify it. Talking to Jigz who has an 02 engine with 00 computer, he thinks this wouldn't make a difference.

At this point myself and the mechanic are equally frustrated. He's got a shop to run and can't spend all his time on this car. Granted, it's not his fault that this May be a different engine. He did his job by changing the sensors, but still I need my car to pass. He feels terrible and doesnt even know what to charge me for his work. So I have no idea what to do at this point. I'll be wasting money trying to figure this out, he's wasting time on it when he's got other cars in his shop to fix...


Any ideas of why these codes would be popping up? How to identify the engine? How to solve my issue??

I went to get my car last night. Still haven't paid him for anything. I've used this guy for a couple years and have trusted him, but to be honest I think he's getting in over his head with business and is short staffed. He put my car back together and drove it and said everythings fine (minus the codes). I get it, drive it and it starts to shake a bit. Pop the hood and the #1 spark plug boot it slightly off. Put it back, no more issue. Go to my car this morning to go to work and the fucker won't start. Sounds like its trying but wont turn over. A few attempts and I get it, but then it dies. Struggle a few more times, get it to turn on, the idle drops low and dies. I also notice this harness under the hood is out of place and out of the loom. Never noticed that before.


Any info/help is much appreciated!! I need to get this car tested and my plate stickers renewed.

[deeznutz]

Looks like the cam sensor plug...

[oakrdrs187]

Each of those codes is a circuit malfunction, I would check the wires and connectors. Maybe a wire is broken or pin is bent.

As for the catalyst code you can replace both O2's but theres a good chance its the cat.

[w/oarctic7g]

I dislike parts changers he didn't do you any favors. I would start by making sure the timing belt is spot on and cam/crank sprockets tight with key-ways in place. I agree with deez, looks like cam sensor plug.

[99galantES]

The yr of the motor does not matter ive changed my cars motor twice ive even had an 03 eclipse motor with no issue but like said that plug goes to the cam sensor

[CHICAGO_ONE]

Thanks for the input guys. It definitely seems that this was majorly overlooked. I'm going over to his shop tonight to talk to him and figure out what he's doing with this car. As well as how much, if any he is trying to charge me.

I brought him a functioning/running car and received it in worse condition. Seeing that plug hanging out and wiring out of the loom got me pretty frustrated, but misfiring and not having it start the next day was even worse.

This is definitely motivation to research a little more and try to fix my own problems next time, rather than drop it off to a shop that doesn't give it proper attention.

Let's see what this guy says.

[underated]

malfunctioning cam sensor / wiring will throw p0340 and P0335
malfunctioning cranck sensor / wiring will only throw p0335 and the car will not start
if your timing is off by a tooth or two you will get p0340 and P0335
a dying battery will also cause codes p0340 and P0335 sometimes


like w/oarctic7g said check the timing. i went through this with a friend not too long ago and his timing was off

[anticon]

What levels in the emissions report caused your car to fail? Timing being off by a tooth causes malfunctions in the head, releasing exhaust at incorrect times, which in turn could effect the emission levels. At the same time, circuitry problems could cause improper firing, a/f ratio, etc. also.
How many miles on the motor? Are there any ticks that you're shrugging off as lifter tick?
I believe my car's timing belt tensioner to have failed. The car drives (drove - the tranny went out shortly after) and idles fine, but there's a noticeible click or tick, and I've pulled the same cam and cranks sensor codes as you. Granted, my car is a v6 and has two heads to make the clatter, so it may be less noticeable on yours. Buy a Haynes/Chiltons manual and you can easily check the timing yourself with simple tools.

[CHICAGO_ONE]

I've got 151,xxx miles on the car. I did have all the belts, tensioner, water pump replaced a couple months ago by this same guy (who I'm starting to second guess). There is indeed a very small tick and I did assume its the lifters.

He's supposedly going to look over the car again in detail today but I'm picking it up tonight regardless. I let him know all of the advice I've received here and told him to triple check Battery, Timing, Cam sensor. He swears the timing is spot on but I think I'm going to have to schedule sometime with Jigz to look over it at some point. He also swears that the engine has parts from another year. He's compared it to his 2004 Galant that he has in the shop and says its the same. It's possible that there is a 4g69 Crankshaft on this? Could that matter for the sensor?

In the past, he's done full timing kit w/ belts, water pump, etc. multiple oil Changes, Valve cover gasket... All of which I assume are still 4g64 and for my car. Otherwise he would've noticed this problem sooner.

[GalantES-2001]

Here is the service manual: http://tearstone.com/eclipsefsm/GR00006800-13A.pdf

You can check those topics to find out what's going on with your car:

DTC P0421: Warm Up Catalyst Efficiency Below Threshold
DTC P0335: Crankshaft Position Sensor Circuit
DTC P0340: Camshaft Position Sensor Circuit

If you go through "TROUBLESHOOTING HINTS" section you will see that there is no direct relation to timing belt.
It may be sensors (O2 front or rear, crankshaft position sensor, camshaft position sensor), connectors or wiring.

For P0421 it could be front catalyst, but most likely it's front O2.

[CHICAGO_ONE]

Not really much progress...

A new crank sensor was recently put in and showed no reading when tested, so that was replaced with another new one. Car still doesnt start.
The cam sensor was actually plugged in when I took that pic and has tested fine. So, that extra harness hanging out is another mystery (possibly temperature sensor).

The old cam/crank sensors were also tested and came out fine.

Since both the old sensors were fine and operational after testing, the mechanic put them both back. This would be the way I brought the car to him in the first place. It WAS a running car without any issue when I brought it in (other than failing emissions). Yet, now it still won't turn on.

Sensors are good, car has fuel, fuel is being sent when you start to turn it on, car gets spark (even put in new plugs), timing is good, battery life is good. He can get a reading on both sensors when he manually turns the engine, but cannot get this thing to fire up.

I guess the next step is to trace the wires and see if theres a kink or cut.

Jigz gave me an 00 ECU / key (what a good guy) Now I need to find out the pinout diagram. Not sure if this should be a last ditch effort or not at this point.

Any ideas?

[Isaurio]

The engine looks like an 02-03 by the valve cover. A bad ground on both cam and crank sensor on the plug or harness wont start the car and gives you problems.

[GalantES-2001]

Not really much progress...
Sensors are good, car has fuel, fuel is being sent when you start to turn it on, car gets spark (even put in new plugs), timing is good, battery life is good. He can get a reading on both sensors when he manually turns the engine, but cannot get this thing to fire up.

If car gets spark and fuel pump is working during cranking the engine, it can be assumed the crank sensor is good and properly wired.
If cam sensor is unplugged it would not prevent engine to start, it should start and then will die in 2 seconds (at least it happens at my Galant 2001).
If coolant temperature sensor (2 contacts) is bad or unplugged a car won't start. So check that sensor too.

[Dominicano]

did you check for any corrosion on your plugs? i had an issue like that but i am a V6 so my camshaft sensor is built into the distributor. I was getting a set of errors because the plug was corroded, once I cleaned that up i got other errors which ended up me having to replace the distributor.

[CHICAGO_ONE]

I finally got the car is back and its running, but the error codes have still not been resolved. At this point, I didn't care. I just wanted it out of this shop. Still haven't payed the guy for anything, nor has he discussed charging me at this time.


Jigz gave me a 2000 ECU to try out, so I think that will be my next step.

just for reference, the AC Switch and Fuel Pump Relay pins need to be switched correct?
Does anyone have a clear diagram of this?
This is what I found
AC Switch #83
Fuel Pump Relay #21 right?

[PR8GG]

Did you double check the main wiring harness? I had a similar problem, with 3 different codes, one was cylinder misfire, other was throttle position sensor, the last one was intake pressure sensor, the car was running very erratic, even the transmission was mis-shifting; after changing all the sensors, and even change the throttle body, it all end up being the wiring; the wiring of the tps and the one from the coolant sensor. the car is now like new. So, please, check the wiring!

[CHICAGO_ONE]

I'll see for myself. The mechanic that had it says he went over all the wiring, but he may have missed something. The car was running fine this entire time, which is the weird part.
I'll be sure to update this thread with anything I find / resolve. I'm running out of days to get my emissions test done/get my plate stickers.

[GalantES-2001]

Jigz gave me a 2000 ECU to try out, so I think that will be my next step.

AFAIK, 2003 Galant does not have speed sensor and speedometer gets signal from PCM, so your speedometer may not work.
Before changing PCM it's better to be 100% sure PCM indeed is the cause of problems.

[PR8GG]

In my case, I don't know how, but one of the wires going to the TPS sensors was broken, inside the cover, and the wires to the Coolant sensor where kind of "rusty" or with some kind of corroding dust, I find it because it was feeling kind of toasted. The point is, it may appear to be impossible but a Mitsubishi mechanic told me these cars suffer from these wires to be fragile, so check with care, inch by inch specially in the area where the wiring is closest to the engine, the heat and stress is what damage them. Good luck, I sure hope you find the problem without having to change the PCM.

[PR8GG]

Anything new with this issue?