Driveshaft

[bytchesgetstyches]

I'm having a hard time finding anyone who is willing to manufacture a one piece aluminum driveshaft for my car, any ideas?

[seth98esT]

www.driveshaftshop.com

[manybrews]

a one piece is probably not that great an idea... in fact, neither is the aluminum.

[bytchesgetstyches]

one piece dramatically reduces binding as well as drag from carrier's. I chose aluminum over carbon fiber for three reasons. 1. Cost. 2. When a carbon fiber driveshaft gets impacted with road debris it stands a very good chance of shattering if already at high rpm. 3. My car is being built as an all engine car with total horsepower expected to be around 275-300 so aluminum is more than strong enough to handle what I'm going to put it through.

[RedGalant2k1]

a one piece is probably not that great an idea... in fact, neither is the aluminum.

Why?

Most trucks use aluminum driveshafts. Just like using forged internals, or other stronger lighter materials its a great idea.

I guess its not a good idea that Mitsubishi uses a aluminum block in the new EVO huh?

[RedGalant2k1]

one piece dramatically reduces binding as well as drag from carrier's. I chose aluminum over carbon fiber for three reasons. 1. Cost. 2. When a carbon fiber driveshaft gets impacted with road debris it stands a very good chance of shattering if already at high rpm. 3. My car is being built as an all engine car with total horsepower expected to be around 275-300 so aluminum is more than strong enough to handle what I'm going to put it through.

Ever think about somebody who has raced those cars? I.E. Buschur racing and his Eclipses, or any other major tuner.

[seth98esT]

www.driveshaftshop.com

[bytchesgetstyches]

Thanks for letting me know about www.driveshaftshop.com. That was what I was looking for.

[manybrews]

a one piece is probably not that great an idea... in fact, neither is the aluminum.

Why?

Most trucks use aluminum driveshafts. Just like using forged internals, or other stronger lighter materials its a great idea.

I guess its not a good idea that Mitsubishi uses a aluminum block in the new EVO huh?

no, its a bad idea because aluminum transfers more noise into the car due to its normally higher operating frequency, and it deflects more.
the noise may not be important to him, but the deflection (especially if he decides to use a long, one piece shaft) should be. Aluminum also generally needs to be larger in diameter to deal with the same loads, so space may be an issue.

the aluminum is not stronger... its mearly lighter, which is great, but really not necessary on a galant.

re-engineering something for the sake of re-engineering it is also a stupid idea.
Dont compare trucks to a car, as the trucks driveshaft is massive, and considered unsprung weight as it moves with the axle. therefor, using aluminum to save 20 pounds effects much more than just the driveshaft itself. It is not that way on a small mitsu.

incidently, why are you constantly trying to start a fight here? Whether you like it or not, I DO know more about mitsus than anyone here. Im not trying to boast nor sound condescending; I'm merely stating that Ive dealing with EVERY aspect of mitsus (and cars in general) longer than some of the people here have probably been alive. Im not sure why you seem to think that my recommendation to not use an aluminum driveshaft somehow correlates to any other piece of the car, either.

[RedGalant2k1]

incidently, why are you constantly trying to start a fight here? Whether you like it or not, I DO know more about mitsus than anyone here. Im not trying to boast nor sound condescending; I'm merely stating that Ive dealing with EVERY aspect of mitsus (and cars in general) longer than some of the people here have probably been alive. Im not sure why you seem to think that my recommendation to not use an aluminum driveshaft somehow correlates to any other piece of the car, either.

Not trying to cause a fight, I always was taught to look at both aspects of a situation. I've never said you aren't knowledgeable nor that you were condescending.

I pointed out other places aluminum is used on cars that are typically subject to high heat and stress like forged pistons or the aluminum engine block.

I should say there is a cast difference between repairing vehicles for stock performance versus racing and increased performance in general. Not saying you don't know about both aspects, but not surprisingly many mechanics couldn't tell you why one metal was used over another. Afterall mechanics aren't engineers and its few and far between of those who are as technically knowledgeable as an engineer.

I guess its simply said that its easier to fix cars than to actually build them.

[bytchesgetstyches]

Just so everyone knows, a one peice aluminum driveshaft would be just fine.... if I did some reworking to the rear suspension to re-align the transfer with the rear differential. When I originally asked I was just starting to look into it, and have found out the front of the driveshaft sits at an angle of 2 degrees, where the back is at 7 degrees, which means one piece all the way back is no good without that suspension work. And deffinetly, an aluminum driveshaft has much more in the area of harmonics because it flexes much more than a steel driveshaft, but, aluminum can be manufactured to 30% stronger than steel in many different usages. This is just info for anyone else with a GSX that happens to come across this site. If I decide to redo the rear suspension to allow for a one piece shaft all the way back, I will deffinetly provide complete documentation on the work for anyone else interested, but at this point, I'm gonna sit with what I've found so far. Thanks again for that website.

[bytchesgetstyches]

One more thing, if I do that suspension reworking, it will be with a 4 bolt rear end instead of the current 3 bolt, so all you VR4 guys (I know it's a really popular switch) may find it interesting. On top of that, if there ARE any VR4 drivers on here who have done this already, I would really appreciate any info you can post on the subject.

[manybrews]

Not trying to cause a fight, I always was taught to look at both aspects of a situation. I've never said you aren't knowledgeable nor that you were condescending.

i ALWAYS look at both aspects. And unless it was a 100 percent race car, I would argue against the cost of a one piece aluminum driveshaft... its not going to do much of anything but drop the weight a bit (maybe 10 pounds).
The frequency changes that occur are much greater than some people realize, hence the reason for my recommendation of not "re-engineering" something just 'cause it can be done.

I pointed out other places aluminum is used on cars that are typically subject to high heat and stress like forged pistons or the aluminum engine block.

Heres the thing about aluminum for an engine block... its really not as well suited for it as cast iron for several reasons. The fact that its structurally weaker and more flexible, combined with its massive increase in thermal expansion and its normally much higher vibration frequencies makes for an engine that can be difficult to engineer for reliability and quietness.
Obviously, those issues have been almost completely eliminated with the used of todays metallurgy, computer engineering, etc.etc... But an aluminum engine is still generally a louder engine that is less suseptable to high stress. Hence the reason that cylinder liners and main bearing supports are still made out of iron even on an aluminum engine.
aluminum cylinder heads are a different thing, as they arent under the same type of load that the lower end of an engine is.
Im not saying aluminum is a poor choice; far from it. But it IS more expensive, and its benefits are often not worth the cost.
The aluminum engine in the new lancer is wonderful, but in reality its only real benefit is that its about 60 pounds lighter than the engine it replaces.
Thats not a HUGE difference, although I agree that every little bit helps.

Note that you wont find aluminum in most severe duty situations...

I should say there is a cast difference between repairing vehicles for stock performance versus racing and increased performance in general. Not saying you don't know about both aspects, but not surprisingly many mechanics couldn't tell you why one metal was used over another. Afterall mechanics aren't engineers and its few and far between of those who are as technically knowledgeable as an engineer.

Im aware that racings requirements are different. Ive built several race-only cars. However, MOST people here are not building race-only cars, and im trying to save people compromises that are probably arent worth it in the real world.
Thats why I say things like "dont use aluminum flywheels on a daily driver", and "dont remove the balance shafts out of a daily driver", etc.

[bytchesgetstyches]

Well, I'm pretty sure I know what the disagreement stems from. Aluminum flywheels, driveshafts, performance injectors, etc. You can put almost any of them on your daily driver... as long as you keep in mind a few things. 1. Perfomance parts go on performance engines. 2. Just about any part can go on any engine so long as the owner/driver can keep in mind that the higher output the engine has, the higher the rate of failure of any and all parts, in and on the engine (high output breeds high maintenence). 3. A mild amount of performance parts can easily be used on a daily driver.... as long as that daily driver is driven as such (i.e. if a driver beats the crap out of a car, the parts the car is made of will fail faster).